RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-packets
"Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" <ginsberg@cisco.com> Thu, 25 October 2018 22:28 UTC
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From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" <ginsberg@cisco.com>
To: Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org>
CC: "Naiming Shen (naiming)" <naiming@cisco.com>, "Reshad Rahman (rrahman)" <rrahman@cisco.com>, "rtg-bfd@ietf.org" <rtg-bfd@ietf.org>
Subject: RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-packets
Thread-Topic: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-packets
Thread-Index: AQHUZn7F2obCS5tWFUCJRL2ls+mZdKUo1C+ggAHIywD//67wkIAAV7mA///Hi8CABg0XgIAAHPRw
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2018 22:28:52 +0000
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References: <E052CA19-228D-4271-BF9E-7499255E7C53@cisco.com> <7332e35048d34d44a65ea70df409699c@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <90B9205E-CBD8-4779-96D1-2D15BD1F7E24@cisco.com> <e08744fc4b264fd1bf9844dd0f29557e@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <59DD4DA1-6C83-4D3D-92E7-B4271EB259E8@cisco.com> <2dc00a0d58db41958ad61d73d08ead17@XCH-ALN-001.cisco.com> <20181025153804.GD12336@pfrc.org>
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Jeff - Inline - hopefully more readable than before... > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeffrey Haas <jhaas@pfrc.org> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2018 8:38 AM > To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.com> > Cc: Naiming Shen (naiming) <naiming@cisco.com>; Reshad Rahman > (rrahman) <rrahman@cisco.com>; rtg-bfd@ietf.org > Subject: Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-packets > > Les, > > I *think* the following text is yours. [Les:] Yes - it is. > > > On Mon, Oct 22, 2018 at 12:36:52AM +0000, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) wrote: > > [Les:] So, this has some implications: > > > > We have both a transmit interval and a multiplier for a BFD session because > we allow that some BFD packets may be dropped for reasons which do not > represent a true loss of connectivity. Therefore up to N-1 consecutive > packets may be dropped w/o triggering a session state change. If large BFD > packets are “occasionally” inserted this means there are intervals during > which N-2 packets drops (not counting the BFD large packet) would be > sufficient to trigger a BFD session state change. Further, if the processing of > the large BFD packets makes it more likely that subsequent BFD packets will > be dropped (e.g., because the processing of the large BFD packet simply > takes longer) then it is possible that a BFD session state change might be > triggered simply as a side effect of the insertion of the large packet into the > data stream. > > > > You also are now defining a “child session” which is embedded within the > parent session. BFD large packets are then not meant to influence the parent > BFD session state and therefore have to be processed separately. This – in > many ways – is equivalent to defining “another protocol”. I’ll grant it might be > a bit simpler as it can inherit some things from the parent session – but it > certainly is no longer simply a transparent part of existing BFD session > operation. > > The draft I had previously worked on with Xiao Min discussing probing using > BFD Echo had the concept of probes that would happen wherein the session > is not torn down. The example carries similarly with the "send occasional". > > I suggest taking a look at a different draft that might help direct this portion > of the discussion: > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bfd-stability-02 [Les:] I have read this draft - not sure how relevant it is. Naiming had suggested that MTU sized packets need not be sent all the time but only occasionally - and that a failure might not be used to take the BFD session down - rather it would be seen as a "soft-failure" and reported separately from the BFD session state. My response was in that context - which it seems was also in your mind in your BFD Echo proposal. This, however, seems not to be what Albert has in mind - as he has since commented that he really wants to have sub-second detection of MTU issues and he wants traffic rerouted "immediately". Les > > > > -- Jeff
- BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-packets Reshad Rahman (rrahman)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Mahesh Jethanandani
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Greg Mirsky
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Naiming Shen (naiming)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Enke Chen
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Reshad Rahman (rrahman)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… bruno.decraene
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… xiao.min2
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Naiming Shen (naiming)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Naiming Shen (naiming)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Mahesh Jethanandani
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Naiming Shen (naiming)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Reshad Rahman (rrahman)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Reshad Rahman (rrahman)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Greg Mirsky
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Acee Lindem (acee)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Naiming Shen (naiming)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Acee Lindem (acee)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Albert Fu (BLOOMBERG/ 120 PARK)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Reshad Rahman (rrahman)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Reshad Rahman (rrahman)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Reshad Rahman (rrahman)
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas
- RE: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas
- BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-packets Reshad Rahman (rrahman)
- Re: BFD WG adoption for draft-haas-bfd-large-pack… Jeffrey Haas