Re: [RTG-DIR] RTG-DIR Telechat review of draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay

Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> Wed, 21 February 2018 13:28 UTC

Return-Path: <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
X-Original-To: rtg-dir@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rtg-dir@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3EAC5124D6C; Wed, 21 Feb 2018 05:28:00 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.781
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.781 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01, T_FILL_THIS_FORM_SHORT=0.01] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (body has been altered)" header.d=eci365.onmicrosoft.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cGzvR6hIdi00; Wed, 21 Feb 2018 05:27:58 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail1.bemta5.messagelabs.com (mail1.bemta5.messagelabs.com [195.245.231.148]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AB25712025C; Wed, 21 Feb 2018 05:27:57 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [85.158.136.83] (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256 bits)) by server-12.bemta-5.messagelabs.com id A0/CD-18682-BD37D8A5; Wed, 21 Feb 2018 13:27:55 +0000
X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA1WTa0gUURiGPTOzO5M5Ma6ZX2KQK1GZmt0XSYi o2JCgfvTHCpvNaXdxLzazhRGFkVkpdiGTdt2wi9hty1q3bMWiRLoslGYZS7lWXkjLos3CIotm 9thtfnw853vf75x3hjMMqQmrExmhyCGINt6iVUdT85OXbEgPShW5mSVnpuuCLVcI3bl7TlLnc uXpQl9/qHUP3F9J3UlPP71Erfe7QrS+tvYboQ897yBWk7kqs81gL9qoMn161kAU1h0kipqHq1 AxCpYRZSiaobhSEnr6D6mUhYarJOB9z34KL14h8O+rp8vQOEbNZYP3Ykit8EQuFV74/bRiIrk TBFwf+oQUIY7Tw9GRMI1NK+HYnQCBeQVUXyqhFKa4afCkIaRSmOXWg6frB4lP60QwHG6NDCNu EowEPJFhkkuA5301EQaOg9rmNhJzPAz2/lRhvwFe9p9CuJ8Mx7vdNOYp0FFTjpQDgPMR0B16r MJCBlw78l4WGJlTwDewAbdXwYvAPQr75UD3P3TR2JMKtwbXYE8BVF8eojCXI7g7ug77j5Pwwf NzLFwSeP3VY6E9aui4lqawhtsE993DY8NtCKq+MIfRLNc/74nZBg8vVtGuyEeKhQfOPsolxyC 5mVDfNBtbkqGy/DWNeQbsdZ+g/+2fRPQFNF0SxG2CmD43wyCajSaHlTdb0udkLsiwCpLEGwUL b5AyNtmtXiRfsyj5uYFGRpe2oMkMoY1naxZX5GomGOz52028ZMoTt1oEqQUlMYwW2D2irMWKg lEo2my2yHf1twxMjHYiyyoyKxXyVslsxFIALWd8PYOlJHM7Ur29Sg0OvJOrr26olNRQNrtNSE xgCfmqazhl2LTV9mfr339CB5qSGMciOawmplAQrWbH//pblMAgbRx7S4kQY7Y5/iR4K4cj5HD t0ZFwDv6vlFiMourScuytH3ty7DkpeWed+q7vwXnObQXLu88zNytjsxd2tz9pjO38PNBGpU7r j1/1Jtq/LP/uDnJoNJBVn/2xye+uKFnUUDw7bBw8EJ532NvYeNV0SX9+Ld3eG/d4YZJz/eeCF U+n7rozP3/8MV/2o6ysfX35xaHmLafTY1ZGrd3ZtFtLSSZ+TiopSvwv6lt58QQEAAA=
X-Env-Sender: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com
X-Msg-Ref: server-11.tower-36.messagelabs.com!1519219669!111668516!1
X-Originating-IP: [52.33.64.93]
X-StarScan-Received:
X-StarScan-Version: 9.4.45; banners=ecitele.com,-,-
X-VirusChecked: Checked
Received: (qmail 13410 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2018 13:27:51 -0000
Received: from us-west-2b.mta.dlp.protect.symantec.com (HELO EUR01-DB5-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com) (52.33.64.93) by server-11.tower-36.messagelabs.com with AES256-SHA256 encrypted SMTP; 21 Feb 2018 13:27:51 -0000
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ECI365.onmicrosoft.com; s=selector1-ecitele-com; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version; bh=diwUJMEVnkLMG73OkI96zL+v5+TFicMjz9yhSsVDF/Q=; b=Zow7B0r9vYjWNWvIzqlHhG5Ntmtz30lMMs2yBHBRED5+xPdTXq26ePae4GoSxdKptqo9AgYQR2lJmJ8KaKStPiCD4QofKeANlaiZ+scWWKCZKMNMUcV9L/gdjiin0Jf1vxv0JxgAem6h2A+1Op95OZ4R1XVulkvOELKQvlrijiw=
Received: from AM2PR03MB0962.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (10.161.129.144) by AM2PR03MB0740.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (10.161.19.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P256) id 15.20.506.18; Wed, 21 Feb 2018 13:27:47 +0000
Received: from AM2PR03MB0962.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::902b:4634:bd47:f227]) by AM2PR03MB0962.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::902b:4634:bd47:f227%13]) with mapi id 15.20.0506.023; Wed, 21 Feb 2018 13:27:47 +0000
From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: Alvaro Retana <aretana.ietf@gmail.com>
CC: "draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay.all@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay.all@ietf.org>, "rtg-dir@ietf.org" <rtg-dir@ietf.org>, "rtg-ads@ietf.org" <rtg-ads@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
Thread-Topic: RTG-DIR Telechat review of draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay
Thread-Index: AdOkuGiEML+eLKrlQ5Ol4wTRIHoKtgF688yAABwRMQAAAC3XEAAAbVhA
Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2018 13:27:47 +0000
Message-ID: <AM2PR03MB096284D275AB71EFC0F441619DCE0@AM2PR03MB0962.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com>
References: <DB3PR03MB096972D1DF55006E50BECCA39DF50@DB3PR03MB0969.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com> <381B2074-0F2C-4FED-8F1B-245B7196A80A@nokia.com> <CAMMESswK-Lf6sy=65LeSv7EK5RmC1QRDiUcmwbeQFV0kmAEcAA@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-originating-ip: [147.234.241.1]
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; AM2PR03MB0740; 7:O85S5nEau59a1gu8qWr+icxEyct+j61IxGs2NPv7ItR+Okg1RaNw+9wJ3xi7/fiwQ1JPjeDgQIpQMsaSIDlNFKUm6Ea0ZpgrWuW9vcXt8JVXvzngsBP1HhfnYWwRmZQY5j7/fpU+ZRpFKkqLN3HJMZpTbEUd0z1C5XkBvHbPL+z5xzSP6rFEh3vXqlTikPSnNUhqdribEY0ugHZQQhPBblhgnc8VaiXbF0/A7O0sLeOIaxgPV3ms5HnCyitySKmz
x-ms-exchange-antispam-srfa-diagnostics: SSOS;
x-ms-office365-filtering-ht: Tenant
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: a079ef20-7d09-4cf4-7fec-08d5792ee5b5
x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(7020095)(4652020)(48565401081)(4534165)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(5600026)(4604075)(3008032)(2017052603307)(7153060)(7193020); SRVR:AM2PR03MB0740;
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: AM2PR03MB0740:
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <AM2PR03MB0740F4C6E2C9DCE5968C0E229DCE0@AM2PR03MB0740.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com>
x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(28532068793085)(82608151540597)(85827821059158)(21748063052155)(279101305709854)(21532816269658);
x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(6040501)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(10201501046)(93006095)(93001095)(3231101)(944501161)(3002001)(6055026)(6041288)(201703131423095)(201702281528075)(20161123555045)(201703061421075)(201703061406153)(20161123564045)(20161123558120)(20161123562045)(20161123560045)(6072148)(201708071742011); SRVR:AM2PR03MB0740; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:AM2PR03MB0740;
x-forefront-prvs: 0590BBCCBC
x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(39380400002)(366004)(376002)(39860400002)(346002)(396003)(76104003)(189003)(199004)(252514010)(478600001)(7736002)(53546011)(6506007)(59450400001)(2900100001)(5890100001)(2906002)(39060400002)(76176011)(72206003)(97736004)(4326008)(8656006)(3280700002)(14454004)(74316002)(6916009)(99286004)(186003)(26005)(102836004)(7696005)(229853002)(68736007)(3660700001)(6246003)(5660300001)(316002)(55016002)(19609705001)(236005)(790700001)(54896002)(6306002)(8936002)(6116002)(9686003)(106356001)(8676002)(3846002)(53936002)(606006)(105586002)(33656002)(66066001)(54906003)(81156014)(25786009)(81166006)(5250100002)(86362001)(6436002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:AM2PR03MB0740; H:AM2PR03MB0962.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en;
received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ecitele.com does not designate permitted sender hosts)
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: wb1UUoQToSFinWy9+q6L8OY7DBl9MOwTrxJbEiJmaDA5FC+1+yyoMemNEEw8jSrnJPi9H60JAr/EqbD8T8NKk7EG4Acld8M36Fr8yyc4xjzChXMMpqVekEECrN5ZFFCG0cUxXi1wUgqI75MkMQ3we3Y4fWydDSjHAeFbAFLi0Fk=
spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99
spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_AM2PR03MB096284D275AB71EFC0F441619DCE0AM2PR03MB0962eurp_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: ecitele.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: a079ef20-7d09-4cf4-7fec-08d5792ee5b5
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 21 Feb 2018 13:27:47.1033 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 2c514a61-08de-4519-b4c0-921fef62c42a
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: AM2PR03MB0740
X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rtg-dir/MJxt45Zd6vVHbh8g6JMI3qo6ELM>
Subject: Re: [RTG-DIR] RTG-DIR Telechat review of draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay
X-BeenThere: rtg-dir@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: Routing Area Directorate <rtg-dir.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/rtg-dir>, <mailto:rtg-dir-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/rtg-dir/>
List-Post: <mailto:rtg-dir@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rtg-dir-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtg-dir>, <mailto:rtg-dir-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2018 13:28:00 -0000

Alvaro,
On the same issue:

-          UMR as an EVPN construct has been first defined in RFC 7543

-          RFC 7543 has not been marked as updating RFC 7432, possibly its usage of UMR has been considered as not generic enough

-          Now the EVPN Overlay for DCI draft uses UMR in a context that is different from the original context of RFC 7543.
Taking all these inputs together, which of these documents should be marked as updating RFC 7432? The options are, IMHO:

-          None

-          RFC 7543 (retroactively, possibly following a Erratum report)

-          The EVPN Overlay for DCI draft (and the RFC to which it will hopefully be progressed)

-          Both - but this is clearly superfluous...
What do you think?


Regards,
Sasha

Office: +972-39266302
Cell:      +972-549266302
Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com

From: Alexander Vainshtein
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 3:17 PM
To: 'Alvaro Retana' <aretana.ietf@gmail.com>;; Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>;
Cc: draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay.all@ietf.org; rtg-dir@ietf.org; rtg-ads@ietf.org; bess@ietf.org
Subject: RE: RTG-DIR Telechat review of draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay

Alvaro,
PWs as an a “virtual ES” are also used in conjunction with EVPN in the scenarios that are not directly related to DCI. One example (actually pointed to me by Jorge during the review process) is the EVPN Virtual Ethernet Segment<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-02> draft (now expired).

It is, of course, up to you to decide whether this justifies marking the draft I’ve reviewed as Updating RFC 7432 because it also defined PWs as a (virtual) ES for EVPN. Alternatively, it is possible to wait until the EVPN Virtual segment draft is resuscitated and progressed – but this can take quite some time...

Regards,
Sasha

Office: +972-39266302
Cell:      +972-549266302
Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>

From: Alvaro Retana [mailto:aretana.ietf@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2018 3:04 PM
To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>>; Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com<mailto:jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>>
Cc: draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay.all@ietf.org<mailto:draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay.all@ietf.org>; rtg-dir@ietf.org<mailto:rtg-dir@ietf.org>; rtg-ads@ietf.org<mailto:rtg-ads@ietf.org>; bess@ietf.org<mailto:bess@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: RTG-DIR Telechat review of draft-ietf-bess-dci-evpn-overlay

Hi!

I see that the change below has already been made in -09.  However, I don’t think that an Update applies in this case.

In general, when Updating another document we’re basically saying: “change what was specified there for what is specified in here”…which, in this case, translates to rfc7432 implementations having to also be compliant with this document (for all cases).  As far as I can tell, the extensions defined in this document are specific to the DCI case and not general to any EVPN scenario.  If that is correct then we shouldn’t be formally Updating rfc7432.

Having said that, Sasha is correct in pointing out that there are several differences with respect to rfc7432.  That is properly captured in the text at the end of Section 2 (for the DCI scenario), without the need for the formal Update.

Thanks!

Alvaro.

On February 20, 2018 at 5:40:59 PM, Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) (jorge.rabadan@nokia.com<mailto:jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>) wrote:

1.       From my POV this draft should be marked as updating RFC 7432 in its metadata. The update should refer to several aspects including at least the following:

a.       Use of Ethernet PWs (see Figure 1 in the draft) as an Ethernet Segment. RFC 7432 defines Ethernet Segment as a set of Ethernet links that connect a customer sit to one or more PEs.

b.       Use of the Unknown MAC Route (UMR). RFC 7432 only says that a PE may flood unicast frames with unknown destination MAC to all other PEs but does not have to do that, with the decision being a matter of local policy;  it neither defines any mechanisms that advertise a specific PE and a specific Ethernet Segment attached to this PE as the “default next Hop” for all unknown destination MAC addresses, nor prevents usage of such mechanisms.
[JORGE] I marked it as updating RFC7432 and explained why in section 2.


___________________________________________________________________________

This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains information which is 
CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have received this 
transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and then delete the original 
and all copies thereof.
___________________________________________________________________________