Re: [Rtg-ooam-dt] kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team

[Erik Nordmark <[e-mail]>]

On 12/17/15 9:48 PM, Mach Chen wrote:
> Thanks Erik,
>
> Yes, it works for me.

Try adding some comment and also some text so I can see what it looks like.

Thanks,
    Erik

>
> Best regards,
> Mach
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Erik Nordmark [mailto:[e-mail]]
>> Sent: Friday, December 18, 2015 1:06 PM
>> To: Mach Chen; Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar); Alia Atlas; Gregory Mirsky;
>> [e-mail]
>> Cc: Carlos Pignataro (cpignata); Ignas Bagdonas; Santosh Pallagatti; Deepak
>> Kumar (dekumar); David Mozes
>> Subject: Re: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>
>> On 12/16/15 5:24 PM, Mach Chen wrote:
>>> Hi Erik and others,
>>>
>>> How about Office Online?
>> Mach,
>>
>> I just shared a test document with you using Office Online. Can you access it?
>> I'd like to check how the simultaneous editing works, and also also whether one
>> can add comments and resolve them. That is useful if we have different
>> "owners" for different sections of the document.
>>
>>      Erik
>>
>>> Best regards,
>>> mach
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Erik Nordmark [mailto:[e-mail]]
>>>> Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2015 12:29 AM
>>>> To: Mach Chen; Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar); Alia Atlas; Gregory
>>>> Mirsky; [e-mail]
>>>> Cc: Carlos Pignataro (cpignata); Ignas Bagdonas; Santosh Pallagatti;
>>>> Deepak Kumar (dekumar); David Mozes
>>>> Subject: Re: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>>>
>>>> On 12/16/15 1:16 AM, Mach Chen wrote:
>>>>> Hi Nagendra,
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for the nice minutes!
>>>>>
>>>>> Regarding google docs, it does not work me, you may know that we
>>>>> cannot access google docs in China L
>>>>>
>>>> Mach,
>>>>
>>>> is there some similar shared editing service which is accessible to you?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>       Erik
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Mach
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:*Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar) [mailto:[e-mail]]
>>>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 16, 2015 12:03 AM
>>>>> *To:* Alia Atlas; Gregory Mirsky; [e-mail]
>>>>> *Cc:* Erik Nordmark; Carlos Pignataro (cpignata); Ignas Bagdonas;
>>>>> Mach Chen; Santosh Pallagatti; Deepak Kumar (dekumar); David Mozes
>>>>> *Subject:* Re: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>
>>>>> Quick minutes captured below. Please feel free to make any changes.
>>>>> We can spruce it up and post it in Wiki page.
>>>>>
>>>>> *Minutes*:
>>>>>
>>>>>     * The initial plan is to start with requirement document and perform
>>>>>       Gap Analysis.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Requirement to be extracted from different existing documents
>>>>> (NVO3, SFC, BIER) and consolidate by end of Jan 2016.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Document what type of issues are we focussing on to solve with
>>>>> this Overlay OAM.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Should be transport independant to avoid re-inventing the wheel
>>>>> for each encapsulation/underlays.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Fault managament is primary. Performance management will be good
>>>>> to have.
>>>>>
>>>>> * ECMP path and related Entropy detection to be considered.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Wiki planned to track the discussion/progress. Can use google docs
>>>>> to track the version of the progress as well. (What did we decided
>>>>> on
>>>>> this)
>>>>>
>>>>> * Re-use existing tool and extend them for overlay OAM.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Consider, what are the entities participating, uni/bi-directional
>>>>> and name them.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Overlay OAM should be synthetic probe based or data-paket inline
>>>>> based to be considered as part of discussion. Considering both is
>>>>> important as it solves different scenarios.
>>>>>
>>>>> *Action Plan:*
>>>>>
>>>>> * Greg to setup google document and will share with everyone to use
>>>>> to include requirements, scope (FM vs PM, Uni/Bi-directional etc).
>>>>> List all the current requirement and relevant drafts.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Come up with requirement details by end of Jan 2016.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Identify the list of existing protocols for Gap Analysis.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Get a consensus on - if (any) existing tool could be extended to
>>>>> satisfy the requirement or to come up with a new protocol.
>>>>>
>>>>> * Depending on the gap analysis - Propose extensions to existing
>>>>> tool or propose a new protocol for Overlay OAM
>>>>>
>>>>> Next Meeting - First week of January 2016.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Nagendra
>>>>>
>>>>> *From: *Alia Atlas <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>>>>> *Date: *Monday, December 14, 2015 at 6:26 PM
>>>>> *To: *Gregory Mirsky <[e-mail]
>>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>>>>> *Cc: *Erik Nordmark <[e-mail]
>>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>>, "Carlos Pignataro (cpignata)"
>>>>> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>, Ignas Bagdonas
>>>>> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>, Mach Chen
>>>>> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>, Santosh
>>>>> Pallagatti <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>,
>>>>> "Deepak Kumar (dekumar)" <[e-mail]
>>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>>, David
>>>> Mozes
>>>>> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>, Nagendra
>>>> Kumar
>>>>> Nainar <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>>>>> *Subject: *Re: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>>>>
>>>>> Sounds good.  I've created a wiki page for the DT and requested that
>>>>> the mailing list be created.
>>>>>
>>>>> The wiki page is at:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://trac.tools.ietf.org/area/rtg/trac/wiki/RtgOoamDT
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Alia
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Dec 14, 2015 at 4:00 PM, Gregory Mirsky
>>>>> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Well, it works automagically, if you click on "Add this meeting
>>>>>
>> <https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=mb336e008e6f3456ecf57c9d87d87
>>>> e
>>>>> a17> to your calendar. (Cannot add from mobile devices.)"
>>>>>
>>>>> Please note, will be using WebEx, not Lync (will cancel it).
>>>>>
>>>>>                   Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Greg
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:*Gregory Mirsky
>>>>> *Sent:* Monday, December 14, 2015 12:57 PM
>>>>> *To:* 'Alia Atlas'
>>>>> *Cc:* Erik Nordmark; Carlos Pignataro (cpignata); Ignas Bagdonas;
>>>>> Mach Chen; Santosh Pallagatti; Deepak Kumar (dekumar); David Mozes;
>>>>> Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)
>>>>> *Subject:* RE: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Alia,
>>>>>
>>>>> many thanks. I'll update the invitation shortly.
>>>>>
>>>>>                   Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Greg
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:*Alia Atlas [mailto:[e-mail]]
>>>>> *Sent:* Monday, December 14, 2015 12:14 PM
>>>>> *To:* Gregory Mirsky
>>>>> *Cc:* Erik Nordmark; Carlos Pignataro (cpignata); Ignas Bagdonas;
>>>>> Mach Chen; Santosh Pallagatti; Deepak Kumar (dekumar); David Mozes;
>>>>> Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Subject:* Re: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>>>>
>>>>> If it is helpful and preferred, here is a WebEx meeting.
>>>>>
>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>>>> From: *Routing Area* <[e-mail]
>>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>>>>> Date: Mon, Dec 14, 2015 at 3:12 PM
>>>>> Subject: (Forward to others) WebEx meeting invitation: Routing
>>>>> Design
>>>>> Team: Overlay OAM
>>>>> To: [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>
>>>>> You can forward this invitation to others.
>>>>>
>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>> Routing Area invites you to join this WebEx meeting.
>>>>>
>>>>> *Routing Design Team: Overlay OAM*
>>>>>
>>>>> Tuesday, December 15, 2015
>>>>>
>>>>> 10:00 am  |  Eastern Standard Time (New York, GMT-05:00)  |  1 hr
>>>>>
>>>>> *Join WebEx
>>>>>
>> meeting*<https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=m6a33d618883c0f7dd2dd
>>>> 3
>>>>> f5dd6104a4c>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Meeting number:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 640 130 410
>>>>>
>>>>> Meeting password:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> rtg-ooam
>>>>>
>>>>> *Join by phone*
>>>>>
>>>>> *1-877-668-4493 <tel:[phone]>* Call-in toll free number
>>>>> (US/Canada)
>>>>>
>>>>> *1-650-479-3208 <tel:[phone]>* Call-in toll number
>>>>> (US/Canada)
>>>>>
>>>>> Access code: 640 130 410
>>>>>
>>>>> Toll-free calling restrictions
>>>>> <http://www.webex.com/pdf/tollfree_restrictions.pdf>
>>>>>
>>>>> Add this meeting
>>>>>
>> <https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/j.php?MTID=mb336e008e6f3456ecf57c9d87d87
>>>> e
>>>>> a17> to your calendar. (Cannot add from mobile devices.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Can't join the meeting? Contact support.
>>>>> <https://ietf.webex.com/ietf/mc>
>>>>>
>>>>> IMPORTANT NOTICE: Please note that this WebEx service allows audio
>>>>> and other information sent during the session to be recorded, which
>>>>> may be discoverable in a legal matter. By joining this session, you
>>>>> automatically consent to such recordings. If you do not consent to
>>>>> being recorded, discuss your concerns with the host or do not join
>>>>> the session.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Dec 14, 2015 at 2:48 PM, Gregory Mirsky
>>>>> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> Hi Erik,
>>>>>
>>>>> I have it for tomorrow @ 07:00 PDT via Lync:
>>>>>
>>>>> àJoin Lync Meeting
>>>>> <https://meet.ericsson.com/gregory.mirsky/VL9PPL8L>
>>>>>
>>>>> Join by phone
>>>>>
>>>>> [phone] <tel:[phone]> (United States)
>>>>> English (United States)
>>>>>
>>>>> [phone] <tel:[phone]> (United States)
>>>>> English (United States)
>>>>>
>>>>> [phone] <tel:[phone]> (United States)
>>>>> English (United States)
>>>>>
>>>>> 89925 <tel:89925> (United States)                         English
>>>>> (United States)
>>>>>
>>>>> _Find a local number <https://dialin.ericsson.com>_
>>>>>
>>>>> Conference ID: 79525896
>>>>>
>>>>> At this time I don't have anything to present, thus we only may need
>>>>> the dial-in bridge. That usually works.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Greg
>>>>>
>>>>> *From:*Erik Nordmark [mailto:[e-mail]
>>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>]
>>>>> *Sent:* Monday, December 14, 2015 11:45 AM
>>>>> *To:* Gregory Mirsky; Carlos Pignataro (cpignata)
>>>>> *Cc:* Alia Atlas; Ignas Bagdonas; Mach Chen; Santosh Pallagatti;
>>>>> Deepak Kumar (dekumar); David Mozes; Nagendra Kumar Nainar
>>>>> (naikumar)
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Subject:* Re: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Greg,
>>>>>
>>>>> Have we nailed down this day/time?
>>>>> Webex or something else?
>>>>>
>>>>>      Erik
>>>>>
>>>>> On 12/11/15 9:14 AM, Gregory Mirsky wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>       Hi Carlos,
>>>>>
>>>>>       thank you and Ignas for casting your ballots.
>>>>>
>>>>>       Tuesday @ 7:00 a.m. PDT still looks as best of all options though
>>>>>       it now stands at 7:2.
>>>>>
>>>>>       Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>>       Greg
>>>>>
>>>>>       *From:*Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) [mailto:[e-mail]]
>>>>>       *Sent:* Friday, December 11, 2015 9:12 AM
>>>>>       *To:* Gregory Mirsky
>>>>>       *Cc:* Alia Atlas; Ignas Bagdonas; Erik Nordmark; Mach Chen;
>>>>>       Santosh Pallagatti; Deepak Kumar (dekumar); David Mozes;
>> Nagendra
>>>>>       Kumar Nainar (naikumar)
>>>>>       *Subject:* Re: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>>>>       *Importance:* High
>>>>>
>>>>>       I just responded to the Doodle poll, Greg. Apologies for the
>>>>>       delay, I had missed it.
>>>>>
>>>>>       - Carlos.
>>>>>
>>>>>           On Dec 11, 2015, at 11:43 AM, Gregory Mirsky
>>>>>           <[e-mail]
>>>>>           <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>           Hi Alia, et. al,
>>>>>
>>>>>           thank you for all who responded to the poll. I haven't heard
>>>>>           from Ignas, Carlos, David and Santosh yet. Thus seven ballots
>>>>>           were casted. We don't have clear winner (7-zip) and the best
>>>>>           chance is Tuesday, December 15^th  @ 7:00 a.m. PDT. Should
>> we
>>>>>           set the meeting for Tuesday?
>>>>>
>>>>>           Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>>           Greg
>>>>>
>>>>>           *From:* Alia Atlas [mailto:[e-mail]]
>>>>>           *Sent:* Thursday, December 10, 2015 11:42 AM
>>>>>           *To:* Gregory Mirsky; Ignas Bagdonas; Erik Nordmark; Carlos
>>>>>           Pignataro; Mach Chen; Santosh Pallagatti; Deepak Kumar
>>>>>           (dekumar); David Mozes; Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)
>>>>>           *Subject:* Re: kicking off the Overlay OAM Design Team
>>>>>
>>>>>           I've only heard from about half of you.  I need to hear from
>>>>>           everyone before making
>>>>>
>>>>>           any type of announcement.
>>>>>
>>>>>           I am going to push the kick-off meeting to next week.
>>>>>
>>>>>           Greg, could you set up a doodle poll for it avoiding Weds and
>>>>>           Thurs mornings?
>>>>>
>>>>>           Sorry for this late email - I was out sick yesterday and not
>>>>>           doing so great today.
>>>>>
>>>>>           Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>>           Alia
>>>>>
>>>>>           On Tue, Dec 8, 2015 at 10:46 PM, Alia Atlas
>> <[e-mail]
>>>>>           <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>           During this past IETF, Greg presented in RTGWG about the
>>>>>           opportunity to try for a generic extensible OAM mechanism
>> that
>>>>>           could be used by multiple of the data-plane encapsulations
>>>>>
>>>>>           currently being defined in the Routing Area.
>>>>>
>>>>>           As I believe you each know from either myself or Greg talking
>>>>>           to you, I am forming a very short-lived design team to work on
>>>>>           Overlay OAM. I believe that the time commitment is likely to
>>>>>           be at least 4 hours a week between now and the end of April.
>>>>>           I would like to confirm with each of you individually that you
>>>>>           are able to make this commitment.
>>>>>
>>>>>           The design team charter is as follows:
>>>>>
>>>>>           "Design Team Charter: Overlay OAM
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>           In the Routing Area, several WGs (e.g. NVO3, BIER, and SFC)
>> are
>>>>>           working on relatively new encapsulations to create overlays.
>> These
>>>>>           overlay or service encapsulations are transport-independent
>>>>>           since they
>>>>>           may be over different transports or at different layers in the
>>>>>           networking stack. Each WG is starting to discuss what OAM
>> and
>>>>>           tools
>>>>>           need to be developed (see draft-ietf-sfc-oam-framework-00,
>>>>>           draft-ietf-bier-oam-requirements-00, and individual drafts in
>>>>>           NVO3).
>>>>>           With increasing use of overlay and service layer tunnels,
>>>>>           extensions
>>>>>           to traceroute to allow visibility into multiple layers are being
>>>>>           discussed (e.g.
>> draft-nordmark-nvo3-transcending-traceroute-01).
>>>>>           There is an opportunity to propose protocols and methods to
>>>>>           provide
>>>>>           Overlay OAM in a sufficiently generic fashion that they can
>>>>>           meet the
>>>>>           requirements and be applied to at least BIER, NSH,
>> VXLAN-GPE,
>>>>>           GENEVE,
>>>>>           and GUE.  A truly successful result would also be applicable
>>>>>           to other
>>>>>           technologies.
>>>>>
>>>>>           This Design Team is chartered to first produce a brief gap
>>>>>           analysis
>>>>>           and requirements document to focus its work on protocol
>>>>>           extensions.
>>>>>           This should be published by March 2016. With that basis, this
>>>>>           Design
>>>>>           Team is chartered to rapidly propose extensions to existing
>>>>>           IETF OAM
>>>>>           protocols such as those discussed in [RFC 7276] and new ones
>> to
>>>>>           support the requirements for OAM from NVO3, BIER, and SFC.
>>>>>           The Design
>>>>>           Team will produce an initial proposal by IETF 95.  It is
>>>>>           expected that the
>>>>>           initial proposal will provide guidance to additional people
>>>>>           who will be
>>>>>           interested in working on the details and gaps.
>>>>>
>>>>>           The Design Team will consider the preliminary OAM
>> requirements
>>>>>           from
>>>>>           NVO3, BIER, and SFC. The Design Team should align with the
>> LIME
>>>>>           WG's work on common YANG models of OAM."
>>>>>
>>>>>           and the anticipated membership of the design team is:
>>>>>
>>>>>             * Greg Mirsky [e-mail]
>>>>>               <mailto:[e-mail]> , DT Lead
>>>>>             * Ignas Bagdonas [e-mail]
>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>             * Erik Nordmark [e-mail]
>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>             * Carlos Pignataro [e-mail]
>>>>>               <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>             * Mach Chen [e-mail]
>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>             * Santosh Pallagatti [e-mail]
>>>>>               <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>             * Deepak Kumar [e-mail]
>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>             * David Mozes [e-mail]
>>>> <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>             * Nagendra Kumar Nainar [e-mail]
>>>>>               <mailto:[e-mail]>
>>>>>
>>>>>           I expect that there will be a publicly archived mailing list
>>>>>           [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>,
>>>>>
>>>>>           which I will ask to be created. There will also be a design
>>>>>           team page on the
>>>>>
>>>>>           wiki where you can collect work, thoughts, and comments -
>>>>>           which would be
>>>>>
>>>>>           publicly available.
>>>>>
>>>>>           I would like to have a kickoff meeting - preferably this
>>>>>           Friday at 10am EST
>>>>>
>>>>>           or early next week.
>>>>>
>>>>>           Please unicast me your thoughts on this design team and
>>>>>           joining it.
>>>>>
>>>>>           Please suggest times in reply - and if need be, we can set up
>>>>>           a doodle poll.
>>>>>
>>>>>           Thanks very much,
>>>>>
>>>>>           Alia
>>>>>
>