Re: [saag] About the "Draft text for a PQ Maintenance WG"

Hi Panos!

No updates.  While there is concrete charter text describing the mechanics of how such a hypothetical WG would operate, it doesn't describe what protocols would be in scope for the initial body of work.  Progress is blocked pending identification of such initial milestones (i.e., what protocols need a PQC re-design but don't have an existing WG to address it).

Feedback continues to be welcome on this list (saag@ietf).  I've been trying to keep a running summary of the PQC work in the IETF at https://trac.ietf.org/trac/sec/wiki/PQCAgility.

Regards,
Roman

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kampanakis, Panos <kpanos@amazon.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2022 11:08 PM
> To: saag@ietf.org
> Cc: Roman Danyliw <rdd@cert.org>; Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
> Subject: RE: [saag] Re: About the "Draft text for a PQ Maintenance WG"
> 
> Hi Roman, Ben,
> 
> Just resurrecting this thread from a few months back.
> 
> Do you know if there will be any updates or progress on this new WG by IETF-
> 113?
> 
> Thanks,
> Panos
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: saag <saag-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Sheehe, Charles J. (GRC-
> LCN0)
> Sent: Thursday, October 14, 2021 8:19 AM
> To: saag@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: [EXTERNAL] [saag] [EXTERNAL] Re: About the "Draft text for a PQ
> Maintenance WG"
> 
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click
> links or open attachments unless you can confirm the sender and know the
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> 
> 
> 
> Hi
> 
> I think the charter looks fine.
> 
> Thanks
> Chuck
> 
> Charles J. Sheehe III
> Computer Engineer
> Secure Networks, System
> Integration and Test Branch (LCN)
> Glenn Research Center
> 21000 Brookpark Rd
> Cleveland, OH 44135
> Charles.J.Sheehe@NASA.GOV Email
> Charles.J.Sheehe@NSS.SGov.Gov SIPRmail
> Office: 216-433-5179
>      It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong
> man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better.
> 
>     The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is
> marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who
> comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and
> shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great
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> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: saag <saag-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Roman Danyliw
> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2021 2:23 PM
> To: Kampanakis, Panos <kpanos@amazon.com>; Salz, Rich
> <rsalz=40akamai.com@dmarc.ietf.org>; Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>;
> saag@ietf.org
> Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [saag] About the "Draft text for a PQ Maintenance
> WG"
> 
> Hi!
> 
> 
> 
> We've heard this confusion on using the "maintenance" short hand to
> characterize this potential body of work.  The intent was what Panos described
> - a short hand where the "maintenance" was on existing IETF protocol to allow
> it to benefit from PQC mechanisms.
> 
> 
> 
> The proposed, templated charter language more precisely captures the intent --
> "The [Planned WG Name] working group ([Planned WG Acronym]) is chartered
> as a WG to analyze, adapt or update IETF protocols, registries, and associated
> code points with PQ cryptographic mechanisms."
> (https://github.com/rdanyliw/ietf-pq-maintenance/blob/main/pqm-charter.md
> <https://gcc02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.
> com%2Frdanyliw%2Fietf-pq-maintenance%2Fblob%2Fmain%2Fpqm-
> charter.md&data=04%7C01%7CCharles.J.Sheehe%40nasa.gov%7Cd092f22f99e
> c48fe1a1a08d983764e40%7C7005d45845be48ae8140d43da96dd17b%7C0%7
> C0%7C637685366837666194%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4w
> LjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000&sdat
> a=mJG8R%2FPW8OcWxEdkDGyJ1P0DxvUhWd2XODuf55oYDSM%3D&reserved
> =0> ).  I've removed "PQ maintenance" from the header of the templated
> charter.  It now reads "PQC Agility WG".  The term didn't appear in the charter
> text itself.  However, to eliminate all possible c  onfusion I also the one instance
> of maintenance by s/protocol maintenance/protocol changes/.
> 
> 
> 
> Roman
> 
> 
> 
> From: Kampanakis, Panos <kpanos@amazon.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2021 12:53 PM
> To: Salz, Rich <rsalz=40akamai.com@dmarc.ietf.org>; Roman Danyliw
> <rdd@cert.org>; Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>; saag@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: [saag] About the "Draft text for a PQ Maintenance WG"
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe maintenance is the wrong word, but the point is to have a WG for
> orphaned (without a WG) protocols like CURDLE was for Curve25519/448.
> 
> 
> 
> From: saag <saag-bounces@ietf.org <mailto:saag-bounces@ietf.org> > On
> Behalf Of Salz, Rich
> Sent: Wednesday, September 29, 2021 12:41 PM
> To: Ludovic Perret <ludovic.perret@cryptonext-security.com
> <mailto:ludovic.perret@cryptonext-security.com> >; Roman Danyliw
> <rdd@cert.org <mailto:rdd@cert.org> >; Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu
> <mailto:kaduk@mit.edu> >; saag@ietf.org <mailto:saag@ietf.org>
> Cc: Kampanakis, Panos <kpanos=40amazon.com@dmarc.ietf.org
> <mailto:kpanos=40amazon.com@dmarc.ietf.org> >
> Subject: RE: [EXTERNAL] [saag] About the "Draft text for a PQ Maintenance
> WG"
> 
> 
> 
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click
> links or open attachments unless you can confirm the sender and know the
> content is safe.
> 
> 
> 
> I find the concept of post-quantum *maintenance* very strange.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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