Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement for post-quantum multi-algorithm PKI
Mike Ounsworth <Mike.Ounsworth@entrustdatacard.com> Tue, 17 September 2019 19:04 UTC
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From: Mike Ounsworth <Mike.Ounsworth@entrustdatacard.com>
To: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>, "secdispatch@ietf.org" <secdispatch@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement for post-quantum multi-algorithm PKI
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Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2019 19:04:06 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement for post-quantum multi-algorithm PKI
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Hi Michael, Yup, Those are the general ideas, with one small correction; for 1) what we've proposed in draft-ounsworth-pq-composite-sigs is a SubjectPublicKeyInfo that has the algorithmID "Composite", and then the octet string for its public key data is an encoded SEQUENCE of SubjectPublicKeyInfos for RSA, PQ1, etc, -- basically the SPKI contains a list of SPKIs. Same trick for signatureAlgorithm and signatureValue. This subtle difference avoids the explosion of pairwise OIDs "RSA+PQ1", "ECDSA+PQ2", etc. Also, this allows a legacy client to continue processing if it doesn't understand the OID for PQ2, but its local policy says that ECDSA alone is still ok for now, so there's a crypto agility win. - - - Mike Ounsworth | Office: +1 (613) 270-2873 -----Original Message----- From: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca> Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2019 1:19 PM To: Mike Ounsworth <Mike.Ounsworth@entrustdatacard.com>; secdispatch@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement for post-quantum multi-algorithm PKI Mike Ounsworth <Mike.Ounsworth@entrustdatacard.com> wrote: > I've posted a new version with minor tweaks to make that more clear. > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-pq-pkix-problem-statement/ Thank you. I understand much better the three possibilities now. As I understand it: 1) new algorithm numbers, "RSA+PQ1", "ECDSA+PQ2", etc. works with old code because old-algorithms are negotiated. Requires negotiation. 2) multiple certificate chains: seems to work well with web servers, but in my experience fails with everything else. The "weak" chain fails and then what? 3) new certificates; the v3-extension hack is just that, a hack to do multiple certificate chains in a single object. I assume that the PQx signature would cover the legacy public key value as well? I prefer (3), btw. (1) hadn't occured to me, as I don't think it works well with objects at rest, such as firmware updates. -- Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>, Sandelman Software Works -= IPv6 IoT consulting =-
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Dr. Pala
- [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quantum … Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Scott Fluhrer (sfluhrer)
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Daniel Van Geest
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Panos Kampanakis (pkampana)
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Kathleen Moriarty
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Michael Richardson
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Salz, Rich
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Michael Richardson
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Mohit Sethi M
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Ira McDonald
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Daniel Van Geest
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Panos Kampanakis (pkampana)
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Ira McDonald
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Salz, Rich
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Ira McDonald
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Salz, Rich
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Ira McDonald
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Douglas Stebila
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Richard Barnes
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Michael Richardson
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Ira McDonald
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Michael Richardson
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Martin Thomson
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- Re: [Secdispatch] [EXTERNAL]Re: Problem statement… Dr. Pala
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… John Mattsson
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Markku-Juhani O. Saarinen
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… John Mattsson
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [Secdispatch] Problem statement for post-quan… Benjamin Kaduk