Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing variability
Martin Hoffmann <martin@opennetlabs.com> Thu, 09 April 2020 12:06 UTC
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Date: Thu, 09 Apr 2020 14:06:54 +0200
From: Martin Hoffmann <martin@opennetlabs.com>
To: Robert Kisteleki <robert@ripe.net>
Cc: Stephen Kent <stkent=40verizon.net@dmarc.ietf.org>, "sidrops@ietf.org" <sidrops@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing variability
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Robert Kisteleki wrote: > > IMO an "RP has no obvious way to acquire missing objects" is not > entirely true. > > If, at the previous run, the RP fetched the relevant (now missing) > object, then I see no reason to not use it again. Think of the > previous run as an object a cache if you will: if you're looking for > an object mentioned in the manifest, and you have it already (hash / > name / etc. matches) then you can reuse it. That is theoretical possible, but in practice you treat synchronising and validation of repository content as two separate steps. I.e, before you even start looking at a CA’s repository, you synchronize its content. This is enshrined in the way both rsync and RRDP work: They don’t update single files but entire directory trees all at once. This step includes deleting objects that have been deleted on the server. Since the complete RPKI repository has a hierarchical structure following the rsync URIs of objects, many RP implementations keep the objects in the file system only. This is in particular useful for rsync: Just let rsync update the directory in place. An additional bonus of this strategy is that you don’t need a fancy database. You could, of course, concoct a mechanism that marks files for deletion and only deletes them if they aren’t actually used in the next validation run. But, considering that this thread is actually subjected “trying to limit RP processing variability,” I am not sure this is a good idea. There is a strong likelihood that different strategies will behave slightly differently. If we really want to come to a point where every RP implementation produces the same output from given input, we need to defined simple rules that are easy to implement in a wide range of circumstances. Another consequence of doing this is that validation on a newly deployed RP software differs from one that has been running for a while. As a consequence, the datasets from two different caches configured in routers differ. So now you even have difference between caches running the same software.[0] Kind regards, Martin [0] Yes, with broken RRDP servers where snapshots differ from a sequence of deltas, this can happen too. We should perhaps also look into improving the robustness of RRDP.
- [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing variabili… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Job Snijders
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Job Snijders
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Robert Kisteleki
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Di Ma
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Robert Kisteleki
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Claudio Jeker
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Robert Kisteleki
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Job Snijders
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Di Ma
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Job Snijders
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Claudio Jeker
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Tim Bruijnzeels
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Tim Bruijnzeels
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Jay Borkenhagen
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Randy Bush
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Robert Kisteleki
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Tim Bruijnzeels
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Randy Bush
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Job Snijders
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Claudio Jeker
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Randy Bush
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… George Michaelson
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Tim Bruijnzeels
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Martin Hoffmann
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Randy Bush
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Rob Austein
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Job Snijders
- Re: [Sidrops] trying to limit RP processing varia… Stephen Kent