Re: [Sidrops] WG Adoption call for draft-borchert-sidrops-bgpsec-validation-signaling-01 (9/16-9/30)

Nick Hilliard <> Wed, 09 October 2019 16:48 UTC

Return-Path: <>
Received: from localhost (localhost []) by (Postfix) with ESMTP id C56B31208CD for <>; Wed, 9 Oct 2019 09:48:04 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.2
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no
Received: from ([]) by localhost ( []) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Eycm5No9TMiB for <>; Wed, 9 Oct 2019 09:48:04 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ( [IPv6:2a03:8900:0:100::5]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AA24F1208D3 for <>; Wed, 9 Oct 2019 09:48:03 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from ( [] (may be forged)) (authenticated bits=0) by (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id x99GlxHa071939 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 9 Oct 2019 17:47:59 +0100 (IST) (envelope-from
X-Authentication-Warning: Host [] (may be forged) claimed to be
To: Randy Bush <>
Cc: "Borchert, Oliver (Fed)" <>, "" <>
References: <> <> <> <> <> <>
From: Nick Hilliard <>
Message-ID: <>
Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2019 17:47:57 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 PostboxApp/
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <>
Subject: Re: [Sidrops] WG Adoption call for draft-borchert-sidrops-bgpsec-validation-signaling-01 (9/16-9/30)
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: A list for the SIDR Operations WG <>
List-Unsubscribe: <>, <>
List-Archive: <>
List-Post: <>
List-Help: <>
List-Subscribe: <>, <>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2019 16:48:09 -0000

Randy Bush wrote on 09/10/2019 17:28:
> if you can subsume ov-egress and the ix draft from de-cix, go for it.

please don't.

draft-ymbk-sidrops-ov-egress is a good idea and although small in scope, 
is important enough to stand on its own.  It is also unrelated in intent 
to either draft-borchert or validating-bgp-speaker.

draft-borchert is a poor idea because pushing the idea of a signaling 
translation layer at the expense of proper RPKI is a poor idea.  But at 
least the damage is constrained to the single administrative domain of 
an ibgp mesh.

draft-ietf-sidrops-validating-bgp-speaker is a bad idea for a number of 
reasons documented on this WG, but mostly because it can cause invalids 
to be propagated to third parties at the cost of squishing valids or 
unknowns.  This is actively harmful.