Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-feature- why notjust use Supported
"Leis, Peter (NSN - DE/Munich)" <peter.leis@nsn.com> Tue, 30 November 2010 08:50 UTC
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Thread-Topic: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-feature- why notjust use Supported
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From: "Leis, Peter (NSN - DE/Munich)" <peter.leis@nsn.com>
To: sipcore@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-feature- why notjust use Supported
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hello, I support solving the 3GPP use case that Christer was refering to in the draft, using the draft as the basis for the work. regards Peter > -----Original Message----- > From: sipcore-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:sipcore-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf Of ext Christer Holmberg > Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2010 4:01 AM > To: Andrew Allen; pkyzivat@cisco.com; sipcore@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-feature- why > notjust use Supported > > > Hi, > > Andrew is correct: just because something isn't a "pure" proxy, it > doesn't mean it is going to modify the Contact header, Supported header > etc. > > Also, I think the use-case (which I have presented on the list) where a > proxy indicates that the Path address information can be used for > routing requests in both direction is an example of a "pure" proxy use- > case. That is also an old problem, that we have discussed earlier every > now and then. > > Regards, > > Christer > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: sipcore-bounces@ietf.org > > [mailto:sipcore-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Allen > > Sent: 10. marraskuuta 2010 3:20 > > To: pkyzivat@cisco.com; sipcore@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-feature- > > why not just use Supported > > > > > > I think the second case Paul describes is what in 3GPP is > > called a Routing B2BUA which sometimes behaves like a proxy > > and sometimes like a UA. IMHO these entities should use > > Record-Route to keep themselves on the path and not write > > their own URI in the Contact but pass the Contact header > > transparently. To do otherwise breaks things like GRUU and > > callee caps. > > > > I support the solving in a general way of how an intermediary > > that provides some kind of funtionality on behalf of a UA can > > indicate its presence to other entities. > > > > Another use case for this is helping to solve service > > interaction problems where multiple application servers are > > involved and the service logic performed by one may need to > > be taken into account by the other. > > > > I also think it is necessary that UAs can detect the presence > > of intermediaries such as IP-PBXs and application servers in > > the path of a session and obtain a URI to which they can send > > requests to invoke service logic at those servers without > > them having to overwrite the contact URI for the reasons stated above. > > > > Andrew. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Paul Kyzivat [mailto:pkyzivat@cisco.com] > > Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2010 07:04 PM > > To: sipcore@ietf.org <sipcore@ietf.org> > > Subject: Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-feature- > > why not just use Supported > > > > I'm tempted to agree with Cullen on this. > > But I think it "depends". > > > > If the B2BUA is a "proper" UA, and inserts its own Contact > > address in the call, then I think Cullen's description is right. > > > > If its a B2BUA because it messes with things a proxy cannot, but > > *doesn't* modify the Contact address, then just manipulating > > Supported isn't enough. Then the features that *it* supports > > are obtainable directly only by sending a request to *it*, > > using the Route header, etc. > > to identify that address. > > > > Its always seemed to me that a UA should always supply its > > own Contact address, but I've looked for verification of that > > in 3261 and not found it. > > > > Thanks, > > Paul > > > > On 11/10/2010 4:42 AM, Cullen Jennings wrote: > > > > > > So, in my week of agreeing with Hadriel, I think he got it > > exactly right when he said there is pretty much no feature a > > "plain" proxy would need for this. If we are talking about > > things that would be a strict technical read be considered > > B2BUA even if they are implemented a lot like a proxy, then I > > can why something provided something like this functionality > > would be needed. > > > > > > But given this would be used by a B2BUA, I don't see why > > you need anything more than just normal option tags. Say a > > SIP message comes from A to B to C and now the response is > > coming back. C says it supports feature c1, c2, and c3. B > > knows that it can transparently forward on whatever is needed > > for c1, c2, but not c3 and it knows that in additional to > > this it can do features b4 and b5. It modifies the Supported > > header to have c1,c2,b4, and b5. and sends that back to A. > > > > > > If the real uses cases have to do with caller pref > > features, then B can modify those in the same way. > > > > > > Anyways, I think we are way way ahead of ourselves > > discussing mechanism before we even understand what the use > > cases are we are trying to solve. I'd like to see some > > specific real world use cases and so we can work out the real > > requirements. I'm expect the uses cases will contain B2BUA in > > the call flows - that's reality. > > > > > > > > > On Sep 24, 2010, at 5:04 AM, Christer Holmberg wrote: > > > > > >> > > >> > > >> Hi, > > >> > > >> I've submitted a draft, which extends the rr-param rule, > > allowing proxies to indicate supported features using feature > > tags in Path, Record-Route etc. > > >> > > >> The draft can also be found at: > > >> > > http://users.piuha.net/cholmber/drafts/draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-f > > >> eature-00.txt > > >> > > >> As I indicated earlier on the list, and as you can read in > > the draft, there is a 3GPP use-case where we believe the > > mechanism could be used. But, there is nothing 3GPP specific > > about the mechanism as such. > > >> > > >> Regards, > > >> > > >> Christer > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> sipcore mailing list > > >> sipcore@ietf.org > > >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sipcore > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > sipcore mailing list > > > sipcore@ietf.org > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sipcore > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > sipcore mailing list > > sipcore@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sipcore > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > This transmission (including any attachments) may contain > > confidential information, privileged material (including > > material protected by the solicitor-client or other > > applicable privileges), or constitute non-public information. > > Any use of this information by anyone other than the intended > > recipient is prohibited. If you have received this > > transmission in error, please immediately reply to the sender > > and delete this information from your system. Use, > > dissemination, distribution, or reproduction of this > > transmission by unintended recipients is not authorized and > > may be unlawful. > > _______________________________________________ > > sipcore mailing list > > sipcore@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sipcore > > > _______________________________________________ > sipcore mailing list > sipcore@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sipcore
- [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header field Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header fie… Paul Kyzivat
- Re: [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header fie… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header fie… Paul Kyzivat
- Re: [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header fie… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header fie… Paul Kyzivat
- Re: [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header fie… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header fie… Paul Kyzivat
- Re: [sipcore] Feature-tags in the Path header fie… Christer Holmberg
- [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Paul Kyzivat
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Elwell, John
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Peter Musgrave
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Leis, Peter (NSN - DE/Munich)
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Leis, Peter (NSN - DE/Munich)
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… gao.yang2
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… DRAGE, Keith (Keith)
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… gao.yang2
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Andrew Allen
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Andrew Allen
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Dean Willis
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Dean Willis
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Dean Willis
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… R.Jesske
- Re: [sipcore] Draft new: draft-holmberg-sipcore-p… Christer Holmberg
- [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-feature- w… Cullen Jennings
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… Paul Kyzivat
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… Andrew Allen
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… Shida Schubert
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… Worley, Dale R (Dale)
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… Leis, Peter (NSN - DE/Munich)
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… Christer Holmberg
- Re: [sipcore] draft-holmberg-sipcore-proxy-featur… hannu.hietalahti