RE: [Sipping-tispan] TIP/TIR service confusion

["Bemmel, Jeroen van (Jeroen)" <[e-mail]>]

Miguel,

Given your example with the Nokia switchboard, in my mind the SIP equivalent of the "direct number" in the PSTN is the Contact address in the 1xx/2xx response to INVITE. So I would expect a service that prevents the caller from receiving this information to remove the Contact from responses. Since the SIP specs don't allow a proxy to do that, the service would be considered a B2BUA, e.g. replacing the Contact for the endpoint with a Contact of its own and forwarding all requests received there to the real callee endpoint.

The above would be my expectation of a "TIR" service, and I think it would work for IMS as well. 

As I see it, standard SIP already performs "TIP" since the caller receives a Contact address (which should be a GRUU), and which it is allowed to store and use for future communications. 

I know that the P-Asserted-Identity header is being considered for this service,  but I don't understand why this is needed considering that SIP already performs TIP (as argued above)

I agree with you that the current text of the draft calls for a general identity, not a contact address. What I'm saying is that to me this does not match the intended service, IMO it constitutes a different kind of service

Best regards,

Jeroen

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Miguel Garcia [mailto:[e-mail]]
> Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2005 1:50 PM
> To: Bemmel, Jeroen van (Jeroen)
> Cc: '[e-mail]'.org'; Jesske, R
> Subject: Re: [Sipping-tispan] TIP/TIR service confusion
> 
> 
> Jeroen:
> 
> I think this deserves a bit more of discussion. See inline 
> comments. I 
> am copying Roland, since I have discussed this service with 
> him quite a 
> few times and he seems to have a better idea of it.
> 
> 
> 
> Bemmel, Jeroen van (Jeroen) wrote:
> 
> > All,
> >  
> > I am confused by the description of the TIP/TIR service 
> > 
> (http://people.nokia.net/~miguel/drafts/pre/draft-jesske-sippi
> ng-tispan-requirements-02c.html#TIP section 
> > 3.3)
> >  
> > As I understand it, "Terminating Identification 
> Presentation" allows you 
> > - as a callee - to give the caller a direct contact to 
> reach the device 
> > you're using to communicate with them at that moment, which may be 
> > different from the address (phonenumber in PSTN terms) 
> which the caller 
> > originally used to reach you there.
> 
> Yes, BUT: the callee can't give a Contact address straight forward, 
> because any SIP request sent to that contact address will bypass the 
> various CSCFs in IMS, and in a few cases, will not reach the callee.
> 
> The calle can use a GRUU though... it will work (whenever IMS 
> supports 
> it, I've heard they are working on it).
> 
> >  
> > A first confusion arises from the distinction between 
> "identity" and 
> > "address", it seems to me that the identification shared 
> here is a kind 
> > of line identification, an address (SIP URI) that leads to 
> a specific 
> > UAC. So not an address-of-record but a contact address as a 
> UAC would 
> > e.g. use for registration, in a Contact header.
> 
> I disagree here. I think the identity is a real SIP URI that is not 
> connected to any Contact address. At least, this is what it has been 
> explained to me.
> 
> >  
> > Specific questions regarding the text in the requirements draft:
> > "These services support the presentation or restriction of 
> a callee's 
> > identity to the caller" - isn't the callee's current 
> contact address 
> > meant here?
> 
> As indicated above, I don't think so.
> 
> > "the callee merely indicates an additional identity where he is 
> > reachable" - could it be any "identity"? I would expect the contact 
> > address of the UAC being used for the call
> 
> This seems to be more of the same... so disagree.
> >  
> > The example provided, which talks about "the real addressable URI", 
> > seems to confirm this. In particular, it is different from a 
> > P-Asserted-Identity value (RFC3325) which contains a 
> "public address" 
> > (AOR) for the user
> 
> Think for example when you call the switchboard of Nokia in Helsinki, 
> and you ask the call to be transferred to me. In principle 
> you won't be 
> receiving my identity. But if I activate TIP, then I can send you my 
> "direct number". I guess this is the spirit of the service.
> 
> BR,
> 
>       Miguel
> >  
> > Regards,
> >  
> > Jeroen
> > 
> > 
> > 
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Sipping-tispan mailing list
> > [e-mail]
> > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sipping-tispan
> 
> -- 
> Miguel A. Garcia           tel:[phone]
> sip:[e-mail]
> Nokia Research Center      Helsinki, Finland
> 

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