RE: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f

["Elwell, John" <[e-mail]>]

Sebastien,

Sorry, but I don't understand why this is outside the scope of the mailing
list, which is there to clarify TISPAN requirements. Why should I attend
TISPAN meetings in order to learn the result of TISPAN decisions on this
matter?

John
 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: GARCIN Sebastien RD-CORE-ISS 
> [mailto:[e-mail]] 
> Sent: 29 September 2005 15:09
> To: Tom-PT Taylor
> Cc: Elwell, John; Miguel Garcia; Michael Hammer (mhammer); 
> Tessa Silvia; [e-mail]
> Subject: RE: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f
> 
> Thanks for clarifying the question which is of interest but 
> out of scope of the mailing list. 
> 
> I invite John and anybody else interested to participate to 
> TISPAN meetings were those questions are debated.
> 
> sebastien
>  
> 
> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Tom-PT Taylor [mailto:[e-mail]] 
> Envoyé : jeudi 29 septembre 2005 15:46
> À : GARCIN Sebastien RD-CORE-ISS
> Cc : Elwell, John; Miguel Garcia; Michael Hammer (mhammer); 
> Tessa Silvia; [e-mail]
> Objet : Re: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f
> 
> Paul has already given his response to the substance of 
> John's question, but I thought I would try to make it clearer 
> to you.  Suppose the caller has multiple devices, say a cell 
> phone and a fixed line, as possible contacts, all through the 
> same address of record.  John is asking whether the call 
> returned by CCBS must come back to the cell phone if that is 
> where the original call came from, or whether any of the 
> devices associated with that address of record could receive 
> the return call.
> 
> GARCIN Sebastien RD-CORE-ISS wrote:
> > John,
> > 
> > I am not sure I understand your question. I assume you are 
> asking about how the O-AS gets the calling party issue the 
> CCBS/CCNR recall or ...?
> > 
> > If this is the case, we are studying several possibilities 
> (3rd party call, REFER...) in TISPAN but none of them have 
> SIP extension requirements.
> > 
> > Could you please be more specific as to what requirement 
> you feel needs to be captured?
> > 
> > sébastien
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > -----Message d'origine-----
> > De : Elwell, John [mailto:[e-mail]] Envoyé : 
> jeudi 29 
> > septembre 2005 14:22 À : GARCIN Sebastien RD-CORE-ISS; 
> Miguel Garcia; 
> > Michael Hammer (mhammer) Cc : Tessa Silvia; [e-mail] 
> > Objet : RE: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f
> > 
> > Sebastien,
> > 
> > Irrespective of the need for a service provider on the 
> caller side, what is the requirement concerning the call 
> resulting from CCBS/CCNR - should it use the same caller UA 
> as that which issued the CCBS/CCNR request, or should it use 
> any UA registered as contact for the AoR concerned?
> > 
> > John
> >  
> > 
> > 
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: GARCIN Sebastien RD-CORE-ISS
> >>[mailto:[e-mail]]
> >>Sent: 29 September 2005 12:58
> >>To: Elwell, John; Miguel Garcia; Michael Hammer (mhammer)
> >>Cc: Tessa Silvia; [e-mail]
> >>Subject: RE: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f
> >>
> >>John,
> >>
> >>Basically it enables "service interactions", "charging model", 
> >>"control of subscriber rights to the service", "playing 
> CCBS related 
> >>announcement"...Having the service logic embedded in an Application 
> >>Server serving the originating user makes all this possible.
> >>
> >>If you want a more detailed to understand the role of the service 
> >>provider acting of behalf of the caller, I suggest you read the 
> >>related section dealing with the originating exchange in 
> ITU-T Q.733 
> >>or contact your Siemens collegues that participate to TISPAN.
> >>
> >>Regards,
> >>sébastien
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>-----Message d'origine-----
> >>De : Elwell, John [mailto:[e-mail]] Envoyé : 
> jeudi 29 
> >>septembre 2005 13:11 À : GARCIN Sebastien RD-CORE-ISS; 
> Miguel Garcia; 
> >>Michael Hammer (mhammer) Cc : Tessa Silvia; [e-mail] 
> >>Objet : RE: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f
> >>
> >>Sebastien,
> >>
> >>I was not trying to open up an old debate. I was simply 
> continuing the 
> >>recent debate about on whose behalf the service provider is acting, 
> >>and whether there are two service providers or one. I can 
> see a role 
> >>for a service provider acting on behalf of the callee, 
> since it needs 
> >>to look out for different UAs registered for the AoR concerned that 
> >>might be in a position to satisfy the CCBS/CCNR request. I 
> am not sure 
> >>I understand what a service provider acting on behalf of the caller 
> >>would do. It would be good to get an answer to my question about 
> >>whether a CCBS/CCNR request results in a call from the same 
> UA as that 
> >>from which the request was made or any UA registered as contact for 
> >>the caller's AoR.
> >>
> >>John
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>From: GARCIN Sebastien RD-CORE-ISS
> >>>[mailto:[e-mail]]
> >>>Sent: 29 September 2005 09:11
> >>>To: Elwell, John; Miguel Garcia; Michael Hammer (mhammer)
> >>>Cc: Tessa Silvia; [e-mail]
> >>>Subject: RE: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f
> >>>
> >>>John,
> >>>
> >>>You seems to want try and open the endless debate about where the 
> >>>intelligence should be placed in the network or in the
> >>
> >>terminals. The
> >>
> >>>approach you are proposing is not something that TISPAN
> >>
> >>will accept so
> >>
> >>>I suggest that we move out of this debate.
> >>>
> >>>sébastien
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>>-----Message d'origine-----
> >>>De : [e-mail] 
> >>>[mailto:[e-mail]] De la part de 
> Elwell, John 
> >>>Envoyé : jeudi 29 septembre 2005 08:20 À : Miguel Garcia; Michael 
> >>>Hammer (mhammer) Cc : Tessa Silvia; [e-mail] Objet :
> >>>RE: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f
> >>>
> >>>Miguel,
> >>>
> >>>In-line,
> >>>
> >>>John
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>-----Original Message-----
> >>>>From: Miguel Garcia [mailto:[e-mail]]
> >>>>Sent: 28 September 2005 10:31
> >>>>To: Michael Hammer (mhammer)
> >>>>Cc: Tessa Silvia; [e-mail]
> >>>>Subject: Re: [Sipping-tispan] Re: CCBS/CCNR in Version -02f
> >>>>
> >>>>Hi Mike:
> >>>>
> >>>>Inline discussion.
> >>>>
> >>>>Michael Hammer (mhammer) wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Miguel,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I think there is still a little bit of schizophrenia in the 
> >>>>>requirements.  I assume that a server is acting on behalf
> >>>>
> >>>>of either the
> >>>>
> >>>>>caller or the callee, but not both because each could be
> >>>
> >>>served by a
> >>>
> >>>>>different host, domain, or organization.  The first
> >>>>
> >>>>requirement seems to
> >>>>
> >>>>>assume that the CCBS is a terminating service of the
> >>>
> >>>callee.  Other
> >>>
> >>>>>requirements seem to assume that the CCBS is a service of
> >>>>
> >>>>the caller.
> >>>>
> >>>>>Which is it?
> >>>>
> >>>>Both. It has been demonstrated that CCBS is a service
> >>
> >>that requires
> >>
> >>>>cooperation of both the originating and terminatine service
> >>>
> >>>providers.
> >>>
> >>>>This cooperation is mostly required to manage queues of both the 
> >>>>caller and callee, and to manage susped/resume states.
> >>>
> >>>[JRE] It is not clear to me what the involvement of the 
> originating 
> >>>service provider is. Perhaps this comes down to what
> >>
> >>exactly are the
> >>
> >>>requirements for notifying the caller that a call may now
> >>
> >>succeed. Is
> >>
> >>>this notification constrained to go to the same UA that requested 
> >>>CCBS/CCNR in the first place, or should it go to any UA currently 
> >>>registered as a contact for the caller's AoR? In my opinion
> >>
> >>the former
> >>
> >>>is sufficient and indeed probably preferable. If I request
> >>
> >>CCBS/CCNR
> >>
> >>>from a particular UA I would expect to receive the notification on 
> >>>that same UA and make the new call attempt from there. In the 
> >>>relatively infrequent event that I move to a different UA in the 
> >>>intervening period, I could simply request CCBS/CCNR again 
> from the 
> >>>new UA.
> >>>
> >>>So on the assumption that CCBS/CCNR involves only a single
> >>
> >>UA on the
> >>
> >>>caller side, what service does the originating service provider 
> >>>perform? Why can't the UA directly request CCBS/CCNR and
> >>
> >>communicate
> >>
> >>>with the service provider on the callee side to achieve this? The 
> >>>caller's UA will receive notification when a the call can
> >>
> >>be made and
> >>
> >>>can present that information to the caller somehow, allowing the 
> >>>caller to choose when to proceed with that call, e.g., whether to 
> >>>interrupt any ongoing communications in order to make that call.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Sipping-tispan mailing list
> >>>[e-mail]
> >>>https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sipping-tispan
> >>>
> >>
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
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> > [e-mail]
> > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/sipping-tispan
> > 
> > 
> 

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