Re: [sop] -- Service Orchestration and Desciption for Cloud Services

"Ashish Dalela (adalela)" <adalela@cisco.com> Sat, 18 February 2012 21:57 UTC

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Thread-Topic: [sop] -- Service Orchestration and Desciption for Cloud Services
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References: <CB62CCB4.C846D%mmorrow@cisco.com> <470D91CE-5D54-48F8-8889-438DA873A3FA@lucidvision.com> <618BE8B40039924EB9AED233D4A09C5103001E76@XMB-BGL-416.cisco.com> <CAHEV9L3EiCHutLEYHTCbPc0b439k_47mda1y1ONmwthKrQMiYw@mail.gmail.com> <CAA3wLqVpK3pYtdFPiHz7YnBrswNQnOW8R91JXdq-3ndsoL9hkA@mail.gmail.com> <4F3D2F02.3020302@raszuk.net> <CAA3wLqVXujsafyD0MuSUrn8oPdooEtSpJJqxkODQipEBkvGv=A@mail.gmail.com> <4F3D3361.4030802@raszuk.net> <CAA3wLqUVwhNzyB6TWf_H-D6g9oR-Kxeg7MqD3BrJps84Tq_7Xg@mail.gmail.com> <4F3D3BD2.4070102@raszuk.net> <618BE8B40039924EB9AED233D4A09C5103001F5D@XMB-BGL-416.cisco.com> <4F3E0AC6.5040402@raszuk.net>
From: "Ashish Dalela (adalela)" <adalela@cisco.com>
To: <robert@raszuk.net>
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Subject: Re: [sop] -- Service Orchestration and Desciption for Cloud Services
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Robert,

>> - is IETF right place to standardize it

This specific question is discussed in section 6 of the requirements
draft. Most cloud services use HTTP (web-services) today. Limitations of
HTTP for cloud services are described in section 8.
	
>> - if IETF does eventually publish something would that be accepted by
community (in particular open source one)

Let's not forget that providers need to differentiate their services
from one another. How will provider services be differentiated if
everyone uses the same open-source software stack? Add proprietary
extensions not published back to open-source?
	
Thanks, Ashish



-----Original Message-----
From: Robert Raszuk [mailto:robert@raszuk.net] 
Sent: Friday, February 17, 2012 1:38 PM
To: Ashish Dalela (adalela)
Cc: sop@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [sop] -- Service Orchestration and Desciption for Cloud
Services

Ashish,

I don't need to go past as I am not stuck :) I see how OS community 
progresses and I am also very heavily involved in IETF standardization 
process and I first hand see how it does not.

It is not the question if it would be nice to have a standard cloud to 
cloud communication. In fact I expressed this already in the first mail 
as reply to Wes.

The questions I see are:

- is IETF right place to standardize it

- if IETF does eventually publish something would that be accepted by 
community (in particular open source one)

Best,
R.

> Robert,
>
> You need to go past this argument that OpenStack is healthy and by
> implication IETF is not. Or, what we have proposed here will break
> OpenStack.
>
> This effort is not opposed to any open-source effort, including
> OpenStack. Its goal is to allow open and closed source to
interoperate.
> Unless you are mandating that every cloud controller on the planet
ought
> to be OpenStack, I don't see how this argument is relevant.
>
> The tradeoff should not be between go open source or you can never
> interoperate. That hasn't worked in the past, and it won't in the case
> of cloud.
>
> Thanks, Ashish
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Robert Raszuk [mailto:robert@raszuk.net]
> Sent: Thursday, February 16, 2012 10:55 PM
> To: Michael Hammer
> Cc: Thomas Nadeau; sdnp; Ping Pan; Monique Morrow (mmorrow);
> sop@ietf.org; Ashish Dalela (adalela)
> Subject: Re: [sop] [Sdnp] FW: New Non-WG Mailing List: sop -- Service
> Orchestration and Desciption for Cloud Services
>
>
>> Yeah, having more than one standard is an issue as well.
>> Would hope that we could converge early on one, but the IETF is what
> it is.
>> But that is not an argument against trying, or you might as well shut
>> down any effort.
>
> Actually my only observation here is that openstack community seems to
> be a very health environment where things actually get done well and
> quick (read like IETF was doing in 1980s and 1990s) so I am just
trying
> to make sure this effort (or whatever it will be end effect of this
> effort here) will not break it or will be even considered by current
> openstack community.
>
> If someone would ask me I would say that cloud to cloud
standardization
> should belong and be done today in openstack community rather then in
> IETF.
>
> Thx,
> R.
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