Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and databases
Henning Schulzrinne <hgs@cs.columbia.edu> Tue, 18 June 2013 22:29 UTC
Return-Path: <hgs@cs.columbia.edu>
X-Original-To: stir@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: stir@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33E5211E811A for <stir@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 18 Jun 2013 15:29:17 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -6.581
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.581 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.018, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pXgGOy2tRpn3 for <stir@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 18 Jun 2013 15:29:12 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from tarap.cc.columbia.edu (tarap.cc.columbia.edu [128.59.29.7]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6974311E8117 for <stir@ietf.org>; Tue, 18 Jun 2013 15:29:12 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [172.20.27.174] (65-125-25-71.dia.static.qwest.net [65.125.25.71]) (user=hgs10 mech=PLAIN bits=0) by tarap.cc.columbia.edu (8.14.4/8.14.3) with ESMTP id r5IMTAoJ012308 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Tue, 18 Jun 2013 18:29:10 -0400 (EDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 6.5 \(1508\))
From: Henning Schulzrinne <hgs@cs.columbia.edu>
In-Reply-To: <9E833ABD-793F-4E0E-9F8E-793BC23DF26F@oracle.com>
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2013 18:29:52 -0400
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <A84AE816-D965-4553-9F22-9AF74F418DE1@cs.columbia.edu>
References: <CDE4E69C.21E90%jon.peterson@neustar.biz> <8C77C05D-6ED2-4429-BF1C-72082F4ADE76@oracle.com> <CCA9D822-C076-467D-AECC-F2312673E6EF@brianrosen.net> <9E833ABD-793F-4E0E-9F8E-793BC23DF26F@oracle.com>
To: Hadriel Kaplan <hadriel.kaplan@oracle.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1508)
X-No-Spam-Score: Local
X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.68 on 128.59.29.7
Cc: "stir@ietf.org" <stir@ietf.org>, "Peterson, Jon" <jon.peterson@neustar.biz>, Brian Rosen <br@brianrosen.net>
Subject: Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and databases
X-BeenThere: stir@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Secure Telephone Identity Revisited <stir.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/stir>, <mailto:stir-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/stir>
List-Post: <mailto:stir@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:stir-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/stir>, <mailto:stir-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2013 22:29:17 -0000
Having been involved in LoST, this isn't quite the same as the PAI "transitive trust". In this particular case, NRA or number assignment authorities would announce their coverage regions, and maybe additional information, such as entry points into DNS or data stores. Each entity would only have to trust announcements, presumably signed, that it likes, rather than receiver of information D trusting that A, B and C on the call path are trustworthy and didn't mangle or fake the information, as in PAI. I don't think there's much of an issue with number allocators trusting each other, compared to trusting a random carrier the recipient has never heard of. Thus, I'd avoid the use of the term "transitive" trust here. Henning On Jun 18, 2013, at 2:54 PM, Hadriel Kaplan <hadriel.kaplan@oracle.com> wrote: > > We already have a transitive-trust of model for caller-id: P-Asserted-Identity. > It's the lack of faith in transitive-trust that brought us here, isn't it? > > -hadriel > > > On Jun 18, 2013, at 1:55 PM, Brian Rosen <br@brianrosen.net> wrote: > >>> I read LoST a long time ago, and skimmed it again today, but I don't get any inspiration relative to STIR. What dots am I supposed to be connecting? >>> No need for a long explanation, just some hints would be good. :) >> LoST avoids a golden root by establishing a kind of transitive trust model where an entity called a "Forest Guide" knows about other Forest Guides and their coverage region by some unspecified means and can refer a request for service in one of the known coverage regions to the proper Forest Guide. Rather than having a root and a delegation model, it relies on Forest Guide operators working out who should be trusted among themselves. >> _______________________________________________ >> stir mailing list >> stir@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/stir > >
- [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Stephen Farrell
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter philippe.fouquart
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Wilhelm Wimmreuter
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Stephen Farrell
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dan York
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Brian Rosen
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dan York
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Wendt, Chris
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Brian Rosen
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Wendt, Chris
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Brian Rosen
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Brian Rosen
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter DOLLY, MARTIN C
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter DOLLY, MARTIN C
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter DOLLY, MARTIN C
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- [stir] Nature vs. nurture -- semantics vs. encodi… Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dan York
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- [stir] Not just "called party" - Re: current draf… Dan York
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] Not just "called party" - Re: current … Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter DOLLY, MARTIN C
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] Not just "called party" - Re: current … Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] Not just "called party" - Re: current … Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dan York
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Paul Kyzivat
- Re: [stir] Not just "called party" - Re: current … Dan York
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] Not just "called party" - Re: current … Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter philippe.fouquart
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Richard Barnes
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter philippe.fouquart
- Re: [stir] current draft charter philippe.fouquart
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Brian Rosen
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Wendt, Chris
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Richard Shockey
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Henning Schulzrinne
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Lee, Yiu
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Michael Hammer
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Dave Crocker
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Lee, Yiu
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Lee, Yiu
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Wendt, Chris
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Peterson, Jon
- Re: [stir] current draft charter - ENUM and datab… Lee, Yiu
- Re: [stir] current draft charter Wilhelm Wimmreuter