Re: [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft-ietf-stox-im-12: (with COMMENT)
Spencer Dawkins at IETF <spencerdawkins.ietf@gmail.com> Fri, 06 March 2015 20:33 UTC
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Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2015 14:33:28 -0600
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From: Spencer Dawkins at IETF <spencerdawkins.ietf@gmail.com>
To: Peter Saint-Andre - &yet <peter@andyet.net>
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Cc: stox@ietf.org, yana@jitsi.org, draft-ietf-stox-im.all@ietf.org, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, stox-chairs@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft-ietf-stox-im-12: (with COMMENT)
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Peter, On Thu, Mar 5, 2015 at 3:54 PM, Peter Saint-Andre - &yet <peter@andyet.net> wrote: > On 3/5/15 10:45 AM, Peter Saint-Andre - &yet wrote: > >> On 3/5/15 10:28 AM, Spencer Dawkins at IETF wrote: >> >>> Hi, Peter, >>> >>> On Thu, Mar 5, 2015 at 10:27 AM, Peter Saint-Andre - &yet >>> <peter@andyet.net <mailto:peter@andyet.net>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi Spencer, thanks for the review. Comments inline. >>> >>> On 3/4/15 10:11 PM, Spencer Dawkins wrote: >>> >>> Spencer Dawkins has entered the following ballot position for >>> draft-ietf-stox-im-12: No Objection >>> >>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply >>> to all >>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to >>> cut this >>> introductory paragraph, however.) >>> >>> >>> Please refer to >>> http://www.ietf.org/iesg/__statement/discuss-criteria.__html >>> <http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html> >>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. >>> >>> >>> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found >>> here: >>> http://datatracker.ietf.org/__doc/draft-ietf-stox-im/ >>> <http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-stox-im/> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------__---------------------------- >>> --__---------- >>> >>> COMMENT: >>> >>> ------------------------------__---------------------------- >>> --__---------- >>> >>> >>> I'm glad to see these specifications moving forward. Thanks for >>> that. >>> >>> I have a couple of you-need-smarter-ADs questions. As prologue, >>> please >>> remember I have a decent understanding of SIP, an indecent >>> understanding >>> of SIMPLE, and mostly, I just stare uncomprehendingly when I >>> see raw >>> XMPP. >>> >>> It did not jump out at me when reading this specification, >>> whether there >>> is any assurance to a sender on one side of the gateway that a >>> message >>> was delivered successfully to a receiver on the other side of the >>> gateway. >>> >>> >>> Assurance is a slippery thing. :-) >>> >>> In XMPP we do have a way to communicate delivery receipts end-to-end >>> <http://xmpp.org/extensions/__xep-0184.html >>> <http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0184.html>> but that's an extension >>> to the core specs. Given that MSRP has a similar mechanism for >>> session mode messaging, we talk about that in draft-ietf-stox-chat >>> instead of draft-ietf-stox-im. >>> >>> >>> I think I understood that. I was just thinking it might be good to say >>> something like "IMs don't return an indication of success or failure, >>> and if you need that, you want to use chat instead". >>> >> >> That sounds reasonable. >> >> The XMPP method can be used for single instant messages, but as far as I >> understand it there's no similar method for page mode messaging in SIP, >> only session mode messaging in MSRP (so it wouldn't be end-to-end for >> single instant messages). >> > > Here is a proposed enhancement to the relevant paragraph in the -im > document: > > Both XMPP and IM-capable SIP systems enable entities to exchange > "instant messages". The term "instant message" usually refers to a > message sent between two entities for delivery in close to real time > (rather than a message that is stored and forwarded to the intended > recipient upon request). This document covers single messages only > (sometimes called "page-mode" messaging), since they form the lowest > common denominator for IM. Separate documents cover "session-mode" > instant messaging in the form of one-to-one chat sessions > [I-D.ietf-stox-chat], as well as multi-party chat sessions > [I-D.ietf-stox-groupchat]. In particular, session-mode instant > messaging supports several features that are not part of page-mode > instant messaging, such as a higher level of assurance regarding end- > to-end message delivery. > That's exactly the kind of edit I was hoping for. Thanks! Spencer
- [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft-iet… Spencer Dawkins
- Re: [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft… Peter Saint-Andre - &yet
- Re: [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft… Spencer Dawkins at IETF
- Re: [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft… Peter Saint-Andre - &yet
- Re: [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft… Peter Saint-Andre - &yet
- Re: [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft… Spencer Dawkins at IETF