Re: [Stox] Brian Haberman's No Objection on draft-ietf-stox-chat-10: (with COMMENT)
Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.net> Thu, 05 March 2015 16:53 UTC
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Message-ID: <54F8898E.8010304@innovationslab.net>
Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2015 11:51:26 -0500
From: Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.net>
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To: Peter Saint-Andre - &yet <peter@andyet.net>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
References: <20150303151639.8667.53395.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <54F797F6.5020803@andyet.net> <54F85777.8060607@innovationslab.net> <54F886E4.7050306@andyet.net>
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Cc: stox@ietf.org, yana@jitsi.org, stox-chairs@ietf.org, draft-ietf-stox-chat.all@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Stox] Brian Haberman's No Objection on draft-ietf-stox-chat-10: (with COMMENT)
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On 3/5/15 11:40 AM, Peter Saint-Andre - &yet wrote: > On 3/5/15 6:17 AM, Brian Haberman wrote: >> Hi Peter, >> >> On 3/4/15 6:40 PM, Peter Saint-Andre - &yet wrote: >>> On 3/3/15 8:16 AM, Brian Haberman wrote: >>>> Brian Haberman has entered the following ballot position for >>>> draft-ietf-stox-chat-10: No Objection >>>> >>>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all >>>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this >>>> introductory paragraph, however.) >>>> >>>> >>>> Please refer to >>>> http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html >>>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. >>>> >>>> >>>> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: >>>> http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-stox-chat/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> COMMENT: >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> No objection to the publication of this document, but I do have a >>>> question for you to consider... >>>> >>>> Sections 4 and 6 talk about implementing timers to deal with the >>>> lack of >>>> a GONE message in XMPP. Any thoughts on having this document suggest >>>> possible values for such timers? Not sure if that makes sense for >>>> protocols much closer to real users, but thought I would ask. >>> >>> The problem is that implementers never agree on the timer values. For >> >> That is what I figured. >> >>> example (in a slightly different context), RFC 4975 notes the following >>> for MSRP-related timers: >>> >>> If success reports are requested, i.e., the value of the Success- >>> Report header field is "yes", the sending device MAY wish to run a >>> timer of some value that makes sense for its application and take >>> action if a success report is not received in this time. There >>> is no >>> universal value for this timer. For many IM applications, it may be >>> 2 minutes while for some trading systems it may be under a second. >>> Regardless of whether such a timer is used, if the success report >>> has >>> not been received by the time the session is ended, the device >>> SHOULD >>> inform the user. >>> >>> In the XMPP community we had quite a bit of discussion about this at one >>> point and couldn't come to agreement. That's why XEP-0085 (Chat State >>> Notifications) states the following about the <gone/> state: >>> >>> User has not interacted with the chat session interface, system, >>> or device for a relatively long period of time (e.g., 10 minutes). >>> >>> The relevant contrast here is with the <inactive/> state: >>> >>> User has not interacted with the chat session interface for an >>> intermediate period of time (e.g., 2 minutes). >>> >>> There's quite a bit of fudging there, but pointing to the specifics of >>> XEP-0085 might be helpful to some implementers. >> >> I think that might be useful, but it is only a Comment. It's up to you >> and your AD to decide if it is worthwhile. > > We might say something like this: > > It is also reasonable for gateways to implement timers that > automatically trigger a "gone" chat state if the XMPP user has not > sent a message within the "session" for a given amount of time > ([XEP-0085] suggests generating a "gone" chat state if the user has > not interacted with the chat session interface, system, or device for > a relatively long period of time, e.g., 10 minutes). > WFM! Brian
- [Stox] Brian Haberman's No Objection on draft-iet… Brian Haberman
- Re: [Stox] Brian Haberman's No Objection on draft… Peter Saint-Andre - &yet
- Re: [Stox] Brian Haberman's No Objection on draft… Brian Haberman
- Re: [Stox] Brian Haberman's No Objection on draft… Peter Saint-Andre - &yet
- Re: [Stox] Brian Haberman's No Objection on draft… Brian Haberman