Re: [Stox] Spencer Dawkins' No Objection on draft-ietf-stox-im-12: (with COMMENT)

[Peter Saint-Andre - &yet <[e-mail]>]

On 3/5/15 10:28 AM, Spencer Dawkins at IETF wrote:
> Hi, Peter,
>
> On Thu, Mar 5, 2015 at 10:27 AM, Peter Saint-Andre - &yet
> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
>
>     Hi Spencer, thanks for the review. Comments inline.
>
>     On 3/4/15 10:11 PM, Spencer Dawkins wrote:
>
>         Spencer Dawkins has entered the following ballot position for
>         draft-ietf-stox-im-12: No Objection
>
>         When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply
>         to all
>         email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to
>         cut this
>         introductory paragraph, however.)
>
>
>         Please refer to
>         http://www.ietf.org/iesg/__statement/discuss-criteria.__html
>         <http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html>
>         for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>
>
>         The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
>         http://datatracker.ietf.org/__doc/draft-ietf-stox-im/
>         <http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-stox-im/>
>
>
>
>         ------------------------------__------------------------------__----------
>         COMMENT:
>         ------------------------------__------------------------------__----------
>
>         I'm glad to see these specifications moving forward. Thanks for
>         that.
>
>         I have a couple of you-need-smarter-ADs questions. As prologue,
>         please
>         remember I have a decent understanding of SIP, an indecent
>         understanding
>         of SIMPLE, and mostly, I just stare uncomprehendingly when I see raw
>         XMPP.
>
>         It did not jump out at me when reading this specification,
>         whether there
>         is any assurance to a sender on one side of the gateway that a
>         message
>         was delivered successfully to a receiver on the other side of the
>         gateway.
>
>
>     Assurance is a slippery thing. :-)
>
>     In XMPP we do have a way to communicate delivery receipts end-to-end
>     <http://xmpp.org/extensions/__xep-0184.html
>     <http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0184.html>> but that's an extension
>     to the core specs. Given that MSRP has a similar mechanism for
>     session mode messaging, we talk about that in draft-ietf-stox-chat
>     instead of draft-ietf-stox-im.
>
>
> I think I understood that. I was just thinking it might be good to say
> something like "IMs don't return an indication of success or failure,
> and if you need that, you want to use chat instead".

That sounds reasonable.

The XMPP method can be used for single instant messages, but as far as I 
understand it there's no similar method for page mode messaging in SIP, 
only session mode messaging in MSRP (so it wouldn't be end-to-end for 
single instant messages).

Peter

-- 
Peter Saint-Andre
https://andyet.com/