Re: [tao-discuss] New Version of the Tao of the IETF

[Niels ten Oever <[e-mail]>]

Cool - text suggestions would be appreciated :)

On 10/4/19 5:50 PM, Kathleen Moriarty wrote:
> I am fine with the suggested edits and following Adrian's guidance.
> 
> Bets regards,
> Kathleen
> 
> On Fri, Oct 4, 2019 at 5:37 AM Adrian Farrel <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
> 
>     I just noticed I wrote…____
> 
>     __ __
> 
>     > I would suggest that the Tao explicitly says what it means.____
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>     __ __
> 
>     Shockingly poor use of English!____
> 
>     __ __
> 
>     I meant…____
> 
>     I would suggest that the Tao should say explicitly what it means.____
> 
>     __ __
> 
>     Best,____
> 
>     Adrian____
> 
>     __ __
> 
>     *From:*Corinne Cath <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>     *Sent:* 04 October 2019 03:42
>     *To:* [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
>     *Cc:* Niels ten Oever <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>; Kathleen Moriarty <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>; Greg Wood <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>; [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
>     *Subject:* Re: [tao-discuss] New Version of the Tao of the IETF____
> 
>     __ __
> 
>     Hi Adrian, ____
> 
>     __ __
> 
>     Thank you for the follow up! A quick comment in-line: ____
> 
>     __ __
> 
>     On Fri, Oct 4, 2019 at 1:01 AM Adrian Farrel <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:____
> 
>         Niels,
> 
>         FWIW most of the IETF lists have assigned "moderators". Those moderators are responsible for handling messages that don’t make it through (for whatever reason) and usually for handling posts from unsubscribed senders.____
> 
>     __ __
> 
>     So maybe it makes sense to add this explainer to the Tao and avoid the rabbit hole? ____
> 
>         I think the term "moderator" is used for the person who has these responsibilities by the list management package.
>         Whether that means those lists are moderated is therefore something we could discuss. But maybe it is better not to?
> 
>         Furthermore, in IRC the term "moderation" usually happens post facto and is similar to what Corinne notes the SAAs doing.
> 
>         I would suggest that the Tao explicitly says what it means. The price of a few extra words for the removal of what turns out to be an ambiguous term (which is, in any case, a buzz word with which some people might not be familiar).
> 
>         Best,
>         Adrian
> 
>         PS. The new mailing list that Corinne is referring to was just announced by Barry Liebe on [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>, and is [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
> 
>         >> 2. related, the current text says that "the ietf discussion list is unmoderated" is that correct? it seems
>         >> like there is some moderation going on, with interventions from the SAA's (leaving aside the debate
>         >> about how much moderation is good moderation) which you mention later on in that paragraph.
>         >
>         > I think the colloquial understanding of 'unmoderated mailinglist' is:
>         >
>         > A moderated mailing list requires each subscriber and message to be approved by the "owner" of a list.
>         >
>         > (from: https://www.calvin.edu/~rbobeldy/tutorials/email/elistserv4.htm)
>         >
>         > In that sense ietf@ietf is unmoderated.____
> 
> 
>     ____
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>     __ __
> 
>     -- ____
> 
>     Corinne Cath - Speth
>     Ph.D. Candidate, Oxford Internet Institute & Alan Turing Institute
> 
>     Web: www.oii.ox.ac.uk/people/corinne-cath <http://www.oii.ox.ac.uk/people/corinne-cath>
>     Email: [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]> & [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
>     Twitter: @C_CS____
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Best regards,
> Kathleen

-- 
Niels ten Oever
Researcher and PhD Candidate
DATACTIVE Research Group
University of Amsterdam

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