Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-ietf-tcpinc-tcpcrypt-09: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
Kyle Rose <krose@krose.org> Mon, 27 November 2017 17:57 UTC
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From: Kyle Rose <krose@krose.org>
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2017 12:57:39 -0500
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To: Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com>
Cc: Daniel B Giffin <dbg@scs.stanford.edu>, "Black, David" <David.Black@dell.com>, tcpinc <tcpinc@ietf.org>, "tcpinc-chairs@ietf.org" <tcpinc-chairs@ietf.org>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-tcpinc-tcpcrypt@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-tcpinc-tcpcrypt@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-ietf-tcpinc-tcpcrypt-09: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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On Mon, Nov 27, 2017 at 12:36 PM, Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com> wrote: > On Mon, Nov 27, 2017 at 9:24 AM, Kyle Rose <krose@krose.org> wrote: > I don't really think it's really worth relitigating this; I'm merely > observing > that if you want high resumption rates then you want stateless resumption. For a server pool, I completely agree. > As for the question of option space, I'm not persuaded it wouldn't > be possible to have stateless resumption with the same number of > round trip times if you were willing to be a bit more careful about > how you handled failure. I would be interested in an (OOB) conversation on your thoughts here. >> Agreed (though I am not sure Mirja will be happy to hear that). My >> comment about scope creep is simply that the WG came to a consensus on >> this topic (resumption tradeoffs) long ago, so I'm not sure we should >> be second guessing that judgment at IETF LC. > > I'm not sure what you think is being second guessed. I was referring specifically to the resumption tradeoffs (rate vs. performance). That said, all I can find is this: https://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/tcpinc/current/msg00919.html which doesn't actually talk about that tradeoff, but rather about the charter's requirement for forward secrecy. > With that said, it's not clear to me that the WG actually did have consensus > that this brittleness was a good tradeoff. Was this property in fact widely > understood? Speaking only for myself, it really only came into focus for me > when I did my review. No, I think you're right that this wasn't widely understood, or at least not discussed. That wasn't what I was referring to, however: I do think the brittleness is worth at least discussing on the list (check) and seeing if there's consensus to make a change to the protocol or to add a crystal clear warning to the draft explaining the critical importance of not reusing SIDs. Kyle
- [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-ietf-tc… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Kyle Rose
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Kyle Rose
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Kyle Rose
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Black, David
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Kyle Rose
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Black, David
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Kyle Rose
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Kyle Rose
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Black, David
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Kyle Rose
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Kyle Rose
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… David Mazieres
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… David Mazieres
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… David Mazieres
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [tcpinc] Eric Rescorla's Discuss on draft-iet… Daniel B Giffin