Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt
Joe Touch <touch@ISI.EDU> Fri, 19 September 2008 20:26 UTC
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Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2008 13:28:17 -0700
From: Joe Touch <touch@ISI.EDU>
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To: David Borman <david.borman@windriver.com>
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Cc: tcpm@ietf.org, rrs@cisco.com, mdalal@cisco.com, "Anantha Ramaiah (ananth)" <ananth@cisco.com>, Ted Faber <faber@ISI.EDU>
Subject: Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt
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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi, David, If we have docs we can point to, we're fine. I had questions from others on this point; if we have precedent, we're set. Joe David Borman wrote: > > On Sep 19, 2008, at 2:04 PM, Joe Touch wrote: > > ... >>> But even if you do view it as a hierarchy, it is nothing out of the >>> ordinary. No optional standard is going to be a MUST for who needs to >>> implement it, but then the rest of the standard itself will have still >>> have MUSTs in it for how to do the implementation. >> >> This is the part that others have commented to me on, and the primary >> point of my note. If we can point to an optional standard that has MUSTs >> therein, fine. If not, we're blazing new ground. > > That's easy, just look at any optional standards track RFC. Here are a > few recent RFCs that I just picked at random: > > RFC 5001 "DNS Name Server Identifier (NSID) Option" > RFC 5007 "DHCPv6 Leasequery" > RFC 5010 "The Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol Version 4 (DHCPv4) > Relay Agent Flags Suboption" > RFC 5044 "Marker PDU Aligned Framing for TCP Specification" > > None of these are mandatory, so at best they would be SHOULD for the > overall document, and yet they all have MUSTs in them. Need I go on? > The only difference I can see is that these standards don't have > explicit SHOULD/MAY in their applicability sections. > > >>> The only thing that >>> might be unique here is that the applicability statement has an explicit >>> SHOULD/MAY in it; they could be changed to should/may and I don't think >>> anything would be lost, but I also think it is fine as it is. >> >> It would definitely be lost; the doc would then have only MUSTs for >> certain items, which are not MUSTs if the overall document is a SHOULD. >> >> This is the punchline; i.e., if we feel that we can't make document-wide >> recommendations at different levels than individual items, then the >> document-wide concern needs to be reflected in the level of individual >> items, and then I would claim that the current MUSTs should be converted >> to SHOULDs. (I don't see other impacts). > > Again, the SHOULD/MAY in the applicability section is about who can > benefit from tcpsecure, and has nothing to do with how to implement > tcpsecure. The other MUST/SHOULD/MAYs in tcpsecure are about how to > implement tcpsecure. > > It's "you SHOULD/MAY implement this, but if you do, you MUST do it this > way". That's just normal standards stuff. > > -David Borman -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.3 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFI1AthE5f5cImnZrsRAmTuAJ9reCQq4gM4b9Yzbidr61YRrFvbQwCfSkr9 uf1SV+aHEvZkmsUr9TUIf8A= =iUCX -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ tcpm mailing list tcpm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tcpm
- [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt David Borman
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Fernando Gont
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Anantha Ramaiah (ananth)
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Fernando Gont
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Fernando Gont
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Anantha Ramaiah (ananth)
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Ted Faber
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt David Borman
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt David Borman
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Eddy, Wesley M. (GRC-RCN0)[VZ]
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt David Borman
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt David Borman
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt David Borman
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Anantha Ramaiah (ananth)
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt David Borman
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Ted Faber
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Ted Faber
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Anantha Ramaiah (ananth)
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Ted Faber
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Anantha Ramaiah (ananth)
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Ted Faber
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Joe Touch
- Re: [tcpm] WGLC: draft-ietf-tcpm-tcpsecure-10.txt Ted Faber