Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ietf-network-slices
Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com> Sat, 08 May 2021 01:55 UTC
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From: Gyan Mishra <hayabusagsm@gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 07 May 2021 21:54:59 -0400
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To: Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
Cc: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, Loa Andersson <loa@pi.nu>, Med Boucadair <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>, TEAS WG <teas@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ietf-network-slices
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I agree with Loa and am not crazy about either customer or consumer as either refers to a “human” endpoint and not a system endpoint made of hardware or software like the term “CE”. +1 for Customer over Consumer as a customer is human endpoint that has paid for service SLA where a consumer is broader term like subscriber describing for example all broadband subscriber community. On Fri, May 7, 2021 at 3:55 PM Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > I agree with Loa, moving the definition of how the term "customer" is > interpreted in the document to the Terms and Abbreviations section seems > very reasonable. Perhaps the section can include two sub-sections - > Abbreviations/Acronyms and Terms/Terminology. I've noticed that there is > the forward reference in the section: > The above terminology is defined in greater details in the remainder > of this document. > It could be those other definitions of terms used in the specific context > in the document be collected in the new sub-section. > > Regards, > Greg > > > On Thu, May 6, 2021 at 12:32 AM Loa Andersson <loa@pi.nu> wrote: > >> Adrian, >> >> That is acceptable. >> >> As you said it is late in the document, and really not in a definitions >> section. I don't know if we can we place something in Section "2. Terms >> and Abbreviations", but there seems to be only abbreviations. >> >> Your wholesale example: >> >> I think you forget about wholesale. What do you call the school that >> buys food at the shop to provide to the children? Do you call the school >> the customer, or do you refer to the cook who buys the food as the >> customer? The contract is with the school, negotiated by the cook, >> signed by the bursar. >> >> I think "the school! is the customer, which is OK in this context. The >> cook and the school kids could be viewed as consumers", one removed from >> the system. >> >> It strikes me that "Customer System" and "IETF Slice" are somewhat >> similar, the risk is that we talk about "customer" (even if we change >> it), and "slice" (even though if is really "IETF Slice)", >> >> Having said that, though it is not my task to call consensus, I think we >> have a enough support to use "customer". >> >> I rest my case. >> >> /Loa >> >> >> On 05/05/2021 13:05, Adrian Farrel wrote: >> > We currently have (in section 5.1, which may be a bit late in the >> document) >> > >> > Customer: A customer is the requester of an IETF Network Slice. >> > Customers may request monitoring of SLOs. A customer may manage >> > the IETF Network Slice service directly by interfacing with the >> > IETF NSC or indirectly through an orchestrator. >> > >> > We could add "A customer may be an entity such as an enterprise network >> or a >> > network operator, an individual working at such an entity, a private >> > individual contracting for a service, or an application or software >> > component." >> > >> > Cheers, >> > Adrian >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com> >> > Sent: 05 May 2021 11:58 >> > To: adrian@olddog.co.uk; 'Loa Andersson' <loa@pi.nu>; teas@ietf.org >> > Subject: RE: [Teas] Moving forward with >> draft-ietf-teas-ietf-network-slices >> > >> > Hi all, >> > >> >> Anyone else got anything to say on the topic? >> > >> > I would simply use "customer" and make sure the definition is generic >> enough >> > to denote a role/entity. >> > >> > Thanks. >> > >> > Cheers, >> > Med >> > >> >> -----Message d'origine----- >> >> De : Teas [mailto:teas-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de Adrian Farrel >> >> Envoyé : mercredi 5 mai 2021 11:59 >> >> À : 'Loa Andersson' <loa@pi.nu>; teas@ietf.org >> >> Objet : Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ietf-network- >> >> slices >> >> >> >> Hi Loa, >> >> >> >>> On customer vs. consumer Adrian says: >> >>> >> >>>> c. "Consumer" vs "customer". I have made this consistent (we >> >> only need to >> >>>> use one term). I selected "Customer" because that seemed >> >> best, but I >> >>>> know some people prefer "consumer". Please discuss if you >> >> are not >> >>>> happy. >> >>> >> >>> If the choice is between customer vs. consumer, I prefer customer. >> >> >> >> OK. So I made an improvement, but... >> >> >> >>> I don't know if it is too late to bring this up. >> >> >> >> It's never too late to bring things up. >> >> >> >>> But I really don't like either, normal language has a strong >> >>> indication that that that a customer is a person (a person that >> >> walks >> >>> inte to your >> >>> shop) and consumer is also a person /that eats what I bought at >> >> your shop). >> >> >> >> I think you forget about wholesale. What do you call the school that >> >> buys food at the shop to provide to the children? Do you call the >> >> school the customer, or do you refer to the cook who buys the food as >> >> the customer? The contract is with the school, negotiated by the >> >> cook, signed by the bursar. >> >> >> >>> IETF specifies "systems", including what goes into SW and HW, but >> >> we >> >>> don't specify normative rules for human behavior. >> >>> >> >>> I don't know if we can talk about Customer System? >> >> >> >> I'm afraid of this getting heavy for the reader. There are 73 >> >> instances of "customer" in the document, and "customer system" may >> >> become tiresome to read. >> >> >> >> Anyone else got anything to say on the topic? >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Adrian >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Teas mailing list >> >> Teas@ietf.org >> >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/teas >> > >> > >> ____________________________________________________________________________ >> > _____________________________________________ >> > >> > Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations >> > confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc >> > pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez >> recu >> > ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler >> > a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages >> > electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration, >> > Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme >> ou >> > falsifie. Merci. >> > >> > This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged >> > information that may be protected by law; >> > they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation. >> > If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and >> > delete this message and its attachments. >> > As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have >> been >> > modified, changed or falsified. >> > Thank you. >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Teas mailing list >> > Teas@ietf.org >> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/teas >> > >> >> -- >> >> Loa Andersson email: loa@pi.nu >> Senior MPLS Expert loa.pi.nu@gmail.com >> Bronze Dragon Consulting phone: +46 739 81 21 64 >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Teas mailing list >> Teas@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/teas >> > _______________________________________________ > Teas mailing list > Teas@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/teas > -- <http://www.verizon.com/> *Gyan Mishra* *Network Solutions A**rchitect * *Email gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com <gyan.s.mishra@verizon.com>* *M 301 502-1347*
- [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ietf-n… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Loa Andersson
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Rokui, Reza (Nokia - CA/Ottawa)
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Belotti, Sergio (Nokia - IT/Vimercate)
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Shunsuke Homma
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… John E Drake
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… John E Drake
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… peng.shaofu
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Dongjie (Jimmy)
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Jeff Tantsura
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Loa Andersson
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Oscar González de Dios
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Igor Bryskin
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… John E Drake
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Igor Bryskin
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… John E Drake
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… niu.xiaobing
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Shunsuke Homma
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Igor Bryskin
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Igor Bryskin
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Joel Halpern Direct
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Tarek Saad
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Greg Mirsky
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Gyan Mishra
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Ogaki, Kenichi
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Xufeng Liu
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… mohamed.boucadair
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Shunsuke Homma
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Teas] Moving forward with draft-ietf-teas-ie… Adrian Farrel