Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process
Trevor Perrin <trevp@trevp.net> Thu, 27 March 2014 22:45 UTC
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Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2014 15:45:56 -0700
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From: Trevor Perrin <trevp@trevp.net>
To: Sean Turner <TurnerS@ieca.com>
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Subject: Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process
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On Thu, Mar 27, 2014 at 2:48 PM, Sean Turner <TurnerS@ieca.com> wrote: > All, > > The TLS WG charter is pretty clear that the intention isn't to design > a completely new protocol but rather to revise TLS, and specifically > to "place a priority in minimizing gratuitous changes to TLS." This > is not to say that we can't consider new cryptographic handshake flows > -- TLS has always been open to that -- but completely replacing TLS > with a new protocol is out of scope for this WG. Hi Sean, Thanks for creating this discussion. The distinction between a "new protocol" (forbidden!) and re-evaluating / updating both the handshake and record layer is not super clear to me. For example: Eric's draft redesigns the TLS handshake around the new concept of "semi-static public keys". That gave me the impression we're willing to consider radical changes! Is that not the case? I also didn't expect such a strict interpretation of the charter, and such a rigid process. Your email in January gave a different impression: """ Rene, A couple of people have mentioned the fact that list of objectives is incomplete or they're worried their issue not being listed means it's out of scope. Right now the charter includes the following to address this (at least in my mind) "Some of the main design goals are as follows, in no particular order:" That list is honestly there to make sure the IESG will be comfortable agreeing to the rechartering. What I hope will happen is that folks can bring their proposals, they get evaluated, and the WG will use its better judgement about what makes sense to get adopted. """ http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/tls/current/msg11257.html That email made it seem like we should not worry too much about the charter, we'd have time for "folks to bring their proposals" later. I would have asked for more clarity on the charter - and the "minimizing gratuitous changes" phrase - if not for that. Anyways, maybe this is just me. If everyone else understand what scope of changes is allowed, and is happy with the step-wise process you describe, then that's fine. I'm happy we're discussing this. But I would personally prefer a more open process based around soliciting and comparing different proposals, without pre-judging in advance what changes are "gratuitous". Trevor
- [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Sean Turner
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Trevor Perrin
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Martin Thomson
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Trevor Perrin
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Peter Gutmann
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Nikos Mavrogiannopoulos
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process t.petch
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Stephen Farrell
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Nikos Mavrogiannopoulos
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Douglas Stebila
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Dan Harkins
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Nikos Mavrogiannopoulos
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Adam Langley
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Trevor Perrin
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Bill Frantz
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Eric Rescorla
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Dan Harkins
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Peter Gutmann
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Peter Gutmann
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Peter Gutmann
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Bill Frantz
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Dan Harkins
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Salz, Rich
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Peter Gutmann
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Bill Frantz
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Dan Harkins
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Watson Ladd
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Dan Harkins
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Peter Gutmann
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process Andy Lutomirski
- Re: [TLS] TLS 1.3 process henry.story@bblfish.net