Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS CCA
Anders Rundgren <anders.rundgren@telia.com> Tue, 18 June 2013 22:18 UTC
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Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2013 00:17:37 +0200
From: Anders Rundgren <anders.rundgren@telia.com>
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To: Geoffrey Keating <geoffk@geoffk.org>
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Subject: Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS CCA
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On 2013-06-18 23:39, Geoffrey Keating wrote: > Anders Rundgren <anders.rundgren@telia.com> writes: > >> https://sites.google.com/site/oauthgoog/gnubby >> >> Luckily for all users Google didn't select TLS CCA (Client Certificate >> Authentication) for their coming U2F system; only a moron would base a >> future consumer authentication system on a scheme that is only suited >> for VPN tunnels and invisible authentications like as ChannelID. >> >> What's missing you may wonder? Well, how about >> >> - Compatibility with web sessions including timeout and logout > > Logout is a client-side function, and occurs (typically) when the user > logs out of their local session and/or quits their web browser. > Timeout occurs when the TLS connection is closed due to inactivity > (typically 60 seconds) and the session resumption token is expired, > which is up to the server; or, looking at it another way, when the > user's screen lock triggers due to inactivity. Yes, but this is not how most web apps work today for good or for worse. > >> - A working credential filtering system > > I think this is mostly due to lack of demand. I wouldn't say it isn't > "working", just that as commonly implemented, it isn't very good. There is a perceived little demand because many organizations who are big users of consumer-PKI have no voice in the IETF. I believe these guys would be slaughtered by the IETF bunch since they don't have exactly the same "lingo" and probably don't know very much about inner life of TLS. > I wouldn't list these as the biggest problems when trying to use > client certificate auth, they can be solved with minor fixes. Minor fixes? I doubt that given the fact that you probably must do something in both ends. > The first major obstacle you'll hit is trying to get users enrolled. Indeed. Which is why Google made it a part of the U2F plot while the rest of the industry has nothing to offer except insanely useless crap like Mozilla's <keygen> and Microsoft's CertEnroll. > Then there are: > > - Enrolling multiple devices > - Key rollover > - Lost devices > - Shared devices > - Public access terminals This can be addressed in due time when you have an enrollment solution. Before that nothing can happen. > and all the other things that people don't think about immediately > when they say "let's replace passwords!" Google may very well be the only party on the planet who have a chance making this in reach for the masses. Microsoft, Banks, Governments and last but not least, the Card industry, have showed that they cannot. Anders
- [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS CCA Anders Rundgren
- Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS C… Adam Langley
- Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS C… Anders Rundgren
- Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS C… Nico Williams
- Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS C… Anders Rundgren
- Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS C… Geoffrey Keating
- Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS C… Anders Rundgren
- Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS C… Geoffrey Keating
- Re: [TLS] Another [Well-deserved] attack on TLS C… Anders Rundgren