Re: [TLS] Last Call: draft-ietf-tls-extractor (Keying MaterialExportersfor Transport Layer Security (TLS)) to Proposed Standard

["Jeffrey A. Williams" <[e-mail]>]

Dean and all,

  I believe that you are correct here Dean.  Further it seems to me that
Certicom is in a round about way attempting to claim a near manopoly
on Extractor technology.  If so, I have no doubt that they will face
serious challanges to such a claim.

Dean Anderson wrote:

> If your interpretation were correct, then we would have to say that
> Certicom is not claiming IPR on _any_ IETF document---draft or
> RFC---since none are listed in Section V. But I think that is obviously
> incorrect---I think you have misinterpreted what should be in which
> section.
>
> Section titles and descriptions:
>
>  Section IV. IETF Document or Other Contribution to Which this IPR
>  Disclosure Relates:
>
>  Section V. Disclosure of Patent Information (i.e., patents or patent
>  applications required to be disclosed by Section 6 of RFC 3979)
>
> Section IV lists the drafts and RFCs.  Section V lists the patents.
> One would not expect to find a draft or RFC listed in Section V, nor a
> patent listed in Section IV.
>
> Extractor and other documents are listed in section IV.
>
>                 --Dean
>
> On Wed, 22 Jul 2009, Joseph Salowey (jsalowey) wrote:
>
> > While I see that draft-ietf-tls-extractor is listed in section IV of
> > #1154 IPR disclosure as related material,  I see that it is explicitly
> > not listed in section V part C which lists what is specifically covered
> > by the disclosure.  I don't think Certicom is claiming IPR on
> > draft-ietf-tls-extractor because it is not among the list of documents
> > in section V.
> >
> > Joe
> >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: [e-mail] [mailto:[e-mail]] On
> > > Behalf Of Simon Josefsson
> > > Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2009 12:32 PM
> > > To: [e-mail]; [e-mail]
> > > Subject: Re: Last Call: draft-ietf-tls-extractor (Keying
> > > Material Exportersfor Transport Layer Security (TLS)) to
> > > Proposed Standard
> > >
> > > With the caveat that I have recently returned from vacation,
> > > and consequently may have missed some clarifications or paged out some
> > > context:
> > >
> > > If the #1154 IPR disclosure is the final word from Certicom
> > > on this document, I don't support advancing this document on
> > > the standards track.  My concern remains that Certicom claims
> > > they have IPR that covers the document -- that is what the
> > > #1154 disclosure says (section IV).  The additional
> > > information provided in the PDF is not helping: it grants a
> > > license for use together with ECC.  It doesn't say anything
> > > about the use without ECC.
> > >
> > > The way I see it, TLS implementers and the broader Internet
> > > does not gain something significant by having this document
> > > published.  Other IETF documents can use the TLS PRF to
> > > derive keying material.  On the contrary, it seems both TLS
> > > implementers and the broader Internet community would be hurt
> > > by publishing the document since having patent threats
> > > looming over widely used techniques has stability and
> > > interoperability impacts.
> > >
> > > I recall that Certicom was positive about clarifying their
> > > intentions so maybe we can continue that discussion and get
> > > something more useful than the recent disclosure.
> > >
> > > Speaking as TLS implementer of the document and document [1]
> > > author that reference this document, /Simon
> > >
> > > [1]
> > > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-josefsson-krb5starttls-bootstrap-02
> > >
> > > The IESG <[e-mail]> writes:
> > >
> > > > The IESG has received a request from the Transport Layer Security WG
> > > > (tls) to consider the following document:
> > > >
> > > > - 'Keying Material Exporters for Transport Layer Security (TLS) '
> > > >    <draft-ietf-tls-extractor-06.txt> as a Proposed Standard
> > > >
> > > > The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks,
> > > and solicits
> > > > final comments on this action.  Please send substantive comments to
> > > > the [e-mail] mailing lists by 2009-08-10.
> > > Exceptionally, comments
> > > > may be sent to [e-mail] instead. In either case, please retain
> > > > the beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting.
> > > >
> > > > The file can be obtained via
> > > > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-tls-extractor-06.txt
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > IESG discussion can be tracked via
> > > >
> > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/pidtracker.cgi?command=view_id&dTa
> > > > g=16821&rfc_flag=0
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Ietf mailing list
> > > [e-mail]
> > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > TLS mailing list
> > [e-mail]
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tls
> >
> >
>
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