Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-poly1305-00.txt
Simon Josefsson <simon@josefsson.org> Mon, 15 June 2015 20:57 UTC
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From: Simon Josefsson <simon@josefsson.org>
To: Viktor Dukhovni <ietf-dane@dukhovni.org>
References: <20150611170317.13732.72719.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <201506122355.45772.davemgarrett@gmail.com> <87r3petrfq.fsf@latte.josefsson.org> <20150614134639.GN2050@mournblade.imrryr.org>
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Date: Mon, 15 Jun 2015 22:57:48 +0200
In-Reply-To: <20150614134639.GN2050@mournblade.imrryr.org> (Viktor Dukhovni's message of "Sun, 14 Jun 2015 13:46:39 +0000")
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Cc: tls@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-poly1305-00.txt
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Viktor Dukhovni <ietf-dane@dukhovni.org> writes: > On Sun, Jun 14, 2015 at 02:17:29PM +0200, Simon Josefsson wrote: > >> > After discussion earlier involving ECDHE_anon cipher suites, it >> > occurred to me that it could be useful to define one for ChaChaPoly in >> > this draft. >> > >> > Is it viable to add a cipher suite name and codepoint for this? >> >> What is the use-case? > > 0. Authentication other than via certificate-based PKI. Establish > anon TLS, and channel-bind the TLS-unique via GSSAPI or some > other authentication method. > > 1. Unauthenticated opportunistic TLS. > > * Server performs no unnecessary signature operations, > since the client can't verify the signature anyway. > (More precisely the client can't verify the authenticity > of the server keys, so it can only determine that somebody > signed the handshake, but no idea whether it is the intended > server). Both those use-cases can be achieved by chosing, say, ECDHE_ECDSA and not verify the signature, right? > * Servers can tell which clients are not verifying their > identity, (definitely the ones the offer or negotiate "anon" > ciphersuites). This is useful information. I don't think you can necessarily infer that from what a client offers. It may behave differently depending on which ciphersuite is chosen. However, maybe we can do: TLS_ECDHE_anon_WITH_CHACHA20_POLY1305 = {0xTBD, 0xTBD} {0xCC, 0xA4} I'd appreciate if others could weigh in their opinion on whether more ECDHE_anon ciphersuites are important or not. /Simon
- [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-poly130… internet-drafts
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Dave Garrett
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Simon Josefsson
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Viktor Dukhovni
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Simon Josefsson
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Jeffrey Walton
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Simon Josefsson
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Nikos Mavrogiannopoulos
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Simon Josefsson
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Hubert Kario
- Re: [TLS] I-D Action: draft-ietf-tls-chacha20-pol… Martin Rex