Re: [TLS] draft-green-tls-static-dh-in-tls13-01

Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> Sat, 15 July 2017 09:30 UTC

Return-Path: <mellon@fugue.com>
X-Original-To: tls@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: tls@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7667D131B0B for <tls@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 15 Jul 2017 02:30:36 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.899
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fugue-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Id7gW7o5Chid for <tls@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sat, 15 Jul 2017 02:30:35 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pg0-x22c.google.com (mail-pg0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c05::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2D26412EC4B for <tls@ietf.org>; Sat, 15 Jul 2017 02:30:35 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pg0-x22c.google.com with SMTP id k14so56624394pgr.0 for <tls@ietf.org>; Sat, 15 Jul 2017 02:30:35 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=fugue-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ssxh9ehKx7AnU23Ycgi5DTuNpcYwEdscMXSi5PR8RG0=; b=uyYEvIudGIQyy/znGi2rSvaWLItoX2aviTs3HiIuIwFXN3nlpRST3BD8Mlm2RsqW7Q LHlThrWSsExzfN88Z5B50jizdBY49BvTPE2yPvLO0oX/6K48ASB2KBK/AwNDFTSjXfcq WxLBR1NUb/jZg1mteghxjvetAXIAfPybzG1slnS8ESa8ucXLnx7y6k6u5ctwoU/daSDF zm+pLH4WlpFM2CM+XPNf80YC1G1ELRzbwYOSYjGxX3dJj23pk34RZnbFACRBg8BO6MLT 3wutOCSN0GJ58Jr2/gK8SD60K+0xn84aaGa5Dy0/wZcVyPyvrLG1pGJfUOnlLT4HfI3x DXEQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ssxh9ehKx7AnU23Ycgi5DTuNpcYwEdscMXSi5PR8RG0=; b=i5387vj7nY34uESfKHbwQzfWvRzfd8dTSGhzyXZ4ZIiei8Pt5JQP4aAXfqBWB2KRKw EsyGwUrpQ6irbLS1T0oF9Ln9iomVFSAtkGyN/6E1HN2fLeXvHWKRlx8oKyzu797MJ4FA lO3rxTIDf9wb1CFgZBuXz9g0195PEs4M1c7cyAN+N6Y0ivyOPessToHgu/9t0vW+GQ7K e5e8ofUOW8xRRTLCyf0rva4ZlTa4WjILdV0obUsHaPz4ejVBiFyveK8goX5siVWm4DAa hq6j0v/zB2GGBmb26Xm2QTJOfWn7aOj6dQJbiYJJPP8Hf3zXzYv53frpK7pWsEByQ/2r eBVw==
X-Gm-Message-State: AIVw112flcXp0gQnuuZRryu1t/EXMnQY++czUPtXan9gmV1yoOSA2Tsz 7CxOt8XUieHNuB/K1axdtGsNhNbG/66m
X-Received: by 10.84.143.1 with SMTP id 1mr14849329ply.103.1500111034797; Sat, 15 Jul 2017 02:30:34 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.100.181.42 with HTTP; Sat, 15 Jul 2017 02:29:53 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <CF285C9C-9822-4B5F-98FC-C5B2701619D4@arbor.net>
References: <CAPCANN-xgf3auqy+pFfL6VO5GpEsCCHYkROAwiB1u=8a4yj+Fg@mail.gmail.com> <CAL02cgRJeauV9NQ2OrGK1ocQtg-M2tbWm2+5HUc4-Wc8KC3vxQ@mail.gmail.com> <71E07F32-230F-447C-B85B-9B3B4146D386@vigilsec.com> <39bad3e9-2e17-30f6-48a7-a035d449dce7@cs.tcd.ie> <CAJU8_nXBFkpncFDy4QFnd6hFpC7oOZn-F1-EuBC2vk3Y6QKq3A@mail.gmail.com> <f0554055-cdd3-a78c-8ab1-e84f9b624fda@cs.tcd.ie> <A0BEC2E3-8CF5-433D-BA77-E8474A2C922A@vigilsec.com> <87k23arzac.fsf@fifthhorseman.net> <D37DF005-4C6E-4EA8-9D9D-6016A04DF69E@arbor.net> <CAPt1N1nVhCQBnHd_MCm79e7c1gO6CY6vZG_rZSNePPvmmU_Bow@mail.gmail.com> <44AB7CB8-13C1-44A0-9EC4-B6824272A247@arbor.net> <CAPt1N1=rvtssKXCnsNmr1vy4ejb6YDUxO2kDcgh-ZMh5WGjfWg@mail.gmail.com> <D43C7836-9F72-4D3C-A8FA-E536FCBEEB6A@arbor.net> <CAPt1N1m6QNmpHY4Zkm3eJSKjBpTs_xaAy6vv6pZi0ySYej_4Sg@mail.gmail.com> <CF285C9C-9822-4B5F-98FC-C5B2701619D4@arbor.net>
From: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>
Date: Sat, 15 Jul 2017 11:29:53 +0200
Message-ID: <CAPt1N1=N5OH7QvYd_L=uDn0S7K9dHZQOaaKmOvPrc-NSSG+Cag@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Dobbins, Roland" <rdobbins@arbor.net>
Cc: IETF TLS <tls@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="94eb2c1194ae5a63bc055457d176"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/ObVUOYXXvzZSrsiAA8Feie-gw1Y>
Subject: Re: [TLS] draft-green-tls-static-dh-in-tls13-01
X-BeenThere: tls@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: "This is the mailing list for the Transport Layer Security working group of the IETF." <tls.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/tls>, <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/tls/>
List-Post: <mailto:tls@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tls>, <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 15 Jul 2017 09:30:36 -0000

On Sat, Jul 15, 2017 at 11:05 AM, Dobbins, Roland <rdobbins@arbor.net>;
wrote:

> There is plenty of information on these topics available on the Internet
> today.  Search engines exist.  It isn't reasonable to expect a class to be
> held on the basics of network security & troubleshooting tools & techniques
> on this WG list.
>

Roland, the reason that I made that particular comment was to try to show
you that the position you have taken here is untenable.   There is no such
textbook.   There is no consensus that what you have said is true.   I
understand that you believe it is true, and I'm sure it's frustrating that
not everybody believes it.   But if you want everybody to believe it, you
have to make your case, and not just hand-wave when I ask you for specifics.