[TLS] Re: Improving the quality of the discussion on the TLS email list

[Ken Kubota <[e-mail]>]

The relationship between RFC 2418 and RFC 2026 was already detailed in [1].

They state that conflict resolution should first be attempted within the working group, with the working group chair(s).
(Note regarding Orr [2]: The Area Director(s) [ADs] are the second step on the escalation ladder; see [1]. The first step is always the Working Group [WG] and Working Group's chair(s) [WG chairs].)

These two RFCs also clearly emphasize openness and transparency. Consequently, actions such as excluding participants or claiming 70% support without supplying evidence -- which prevents participants from verifying the claim -- violate these RFCs exactly.

In other words, the RFCs you referred to support Andrew's position [3], not Filippo's [4]; therefore, the discussion should take place here within the working group with the working group chairs first, asking them to comply with IETF standards of openness and transparency.

Simply dismissing legitimate criticism with impolite phrasing ("Go read [...]" [5]) or other direct or indirect attempts to justify the working group chairs' lack of transparency ("can give it a useful try" [6]) will not pull this working group out of the hole it crashed into.

Kind regards,

Ken Kubota

____________________________________________________

Ken Kubota
https://doi.org/10.4444/100



[1] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/ByLJ7Kf1EbP2fESF5R4KRhkKPsE/

[2] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/3pMbxvdca-lpwpEoJMHBdfE_uG8/

[3] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/xLZ6nZF8aAVgXEU3ht87YbJ44zQ/

[4] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/6Y4oDbqc8oKaU4muPy4aobCWBEA/

[5] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/bm6aH__5ZIOZWaQo-MGnXXbt6Pc/

[6] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/6Y4oDbqc8oKaU4muPy4aobCWBEA/



> Am 31.07.2026 um 21:14 schrieb Salz, Rich <rsalz=[e-mail]>:
> 
>     • Nobody should have to guess at blackbox processes when it comes to the security of the billions of people on the internet. Further, an appeal cannot be conducted when the process which produced the outcome is unclear.
> 
> Go read RFC 2418 which describes how IETF working groups work.  And then read RFC 2026 which describes how decisions are appealed. Fillipo was terse, but he was neither wrong, nor unserious.
> 
> 
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