[TLS] Re: draft-kwiatkowski-tls-ecdhe-mlkem and P-384

Alicja Kario <hkario@redhat.com> Mon, 09 September 2024 13:16 UTC

Return-Path: <hkario@redhat.com>
X-Original-To: tls@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: tls@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEF22C14F61B for <tls@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 9 Sep 2024 06:16:56 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.253
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.253 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.148, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=redhat.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GW__1Eb_brKF for <tls@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 9 Sep 2024 06:16:56 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com (us-smtp-delivery-124.mimecast.com [170.10.129.124]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature ECDSA (P-256) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 12ED3C14F616 for <tls@ietf.org>; Mon, 9 Sep 2024 06:16:55 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=redhat.com; s=mimecast20190719; t=1725887814; h=from:from:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date:message-id:message-id: to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version:content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references; bh=2JX0IfrBlp6+45NOuBL1KlXMK3JcZkTUZLqiDnOrZ7k=; b=VyizWFx1cWUmVyJPlDFr90ouRPa4b2MIPzCDc0XGXq/CxGNzhs2vW9VLTimBD+c5x0aQQe a8SHmvYnkz72yYgeWOtLhPGNN47RiVm/uSHXfCnZ7NaDKvVcSVS4/omdC3l5WX2ms7Dmxa KBBo6nLx0jwczwnDkUxCigAHh7KpMqo=
Received: from mail-wm1-f71.google.com (mail-wm1-f71.google.com [209.85.128.71]) by relay.mimecast.com with ESMTP with STARTTLS (version=TLSv1.3, cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id us-mta-609-eCxD2SypOFaWxQbC8rIXJQ-1; Mon, 09 Sep 2024 09:16:53 -0400
X-MC-Unique: eCxD2SypOFaWxQbC8rIXJQ-1
Received: by mail-wm1-f71.google.com with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-42cb08ed3a6so8182325e9.0 for <tls@ietf.org>; Mon, 09 Sep 2024 06:16:53 -0700 (PDT)
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1725887812; x=1726492612; h=content-transfer-encoding:user-agent:organization:references :in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:date:subject:cc:to:from :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=V1/tI3qDKsVxF/n8tHNeEz5sEITq/714QYaZ5+Ka2yI=; b=Lj3a42idersXvHwvhM1SUIJ3qdATO8HFAF2S/CVOZyiblXtArIdigdr0ZV3uxzxPRz HL+ma5WfvZfBoEEUz5fFvTs+9DEXrD03kkK0TvOKZFEoR6w3FHTXXJJlDipZCBjxLBTm puThVSIzC1cphDssD/1KDezX8TMH8SkGgb9GYloLt87QLJRRi+AITZHR2OawK0eetFEa MSi3zetJRfixGWCR5lGghuZkt+c5oprpPCXCjnLi6TFGmB25X1NuW0s2YA7ntoZVLsm5 Tt0jsQkYHGyD1xaSCgjsNqL0RkGF/o9QWlhFdrTPZLVoxsb1HJqGyW+/0UMAsPnTkaMH dVwg==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCWXf3NXYA3cYi2DjOn1ai5QGXO0BUJnafn6RP/g95VPnq5DYaugwby7ROgV7zefZqV9KXY=@ietf.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwpW0uR6RihNZqkF2OLr/uUUqSm+WrihyqwHLELk0U7v7J3UOnV 51jhsgJkNCrbXNwLF9muJERumEQq7XWBnNOnQmjfkfz0Mh7Nwy9WFPdGUtulBWz8StqJbZtM8ke xzj3nU9O4fkgoRHsr3T6HkIw0ZpV6M3xx2L9CVqa4
X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:3501:b0:42c:b81b:c49c with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-42cb81bc6demr18927055e9.10.1725887812529; Mon, 09 Sep 2024 06:16:52 -0700 (PDT)
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IHsafZj1Zhwt0tC0j03eti9IJu4YfCtIgvaN+9Y9UBccKHHb2d8onrGoq1dzontdcURTcYcXg==
X-Received: by 2002:a05:600c:3501:b0:42c:b81b:c49c with SMTP id 5b1f17b1804b1-42cb81bc6demr18926785e9.10.1725887811970; Mon, 09 Sep 2024 06:16:51 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (ip-94-112-13-93.bb.vodafone.cz. [94.112.13.93]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 5b1f17b1804b1-42caeaba04csm76806255e9.0.2024.09.09.06.16.51 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Mon, 09 Sep 2024 06:16:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Alicja Kario <hkario@redhat.com>
To: Bas Westerbaan <bas@cloudflare.com>
Date: Mon, 09 Sep 2024 15:16:50 +0200
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <d0ba90c1-c19f-4d48-b9fb-269cd4f9c5d1@redhat.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAMjbhoVOt4ys3mXdXzYNM_+7xkVF7OuDYYfciSGUEnKkhLj49Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <def1e084-759e-471c-831f-2a40c7d40209@redhat.com> <679c304083b546d69b630fa81b3d87b7@amongbytes.com> <326f4b2d-1d85-4335-84c5-29f28468995f@redhat.com> <CAMjbhoVOt4ys3mXdXzYNM_+7xkVF7OuDYYfciSGUEnKkhLj49Q@mail.gmail.com>
Organization: Red Hat
User-Agent: Trojita/0.7-git; Qt/5.15.13; xcb; Linux; Fedora release 39 (Thirty Nine)
X-Mimecast-Spam-Score: 0
X-Mimecast-Originator: redhat.com
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-ID-Hash: CRXICAY2SKUFYJIHJQRY4BDCGJMGTVEC
X-Message-ID-Hash: CRXICAY2SKUFYJIHJQRY4BDCGJMGTVEC
X-MailFrom: hkario@redhat.com
X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tls.ietf.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header
CC: tls@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.9rc4
Precedence: list
Subject: [TLS] Re: draft-kwiatkowski-tls-ecdhe-mlkem and P-384
List-Id: "This is the mailing list for the Transport Layer Security working group of the IETF." <tls.ietf.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/uazt9wNbJSUsld5Ps6XeW-q-qWw>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/tls>
List-Help: <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Owner: <mailto:tls-owner@ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:tls@ietf.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:tls-join@ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:tls-leave@ietf.org>

Not explicitly, but it is definied in other protocols, like CMS where it
was asked for explicitly.

I can remove it, but I think that omiting it will make the document
appear more biased towards NIST curves than Edwards ones...

On Monday, 9 September 2024 15:09:45 CEST, Bas Westerbaan wrote:
> Did anyone ask for X448?
>
> On Mon, Sep 9, 2024 at 3:00 PM Alicja Kario <hkario@redhat.com> wrote:
> On Monday, 9 September 2024 02:04:48 CEST, kris wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> I'm sorry, possibly I've missed some emails.
>> If there is an interest I propose we add it to existing draft, 
>> publish version -03 and request a code point.
>> The repo is here:
>> https://github.com/post-quantum-cryptography/draft-kwiatkowski-tls-ecdhe-mlkem
>>
>> Feel free to open PR
>
> done:
> https://github.com/post-quantum-cryptography/draft-kwiatkowski-tls-ecdhe-mlkem/pull/22
>
>> Cheers,
>> Kris
>> From: Alicja Kario <hkario@redhat.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, September 7, 2024 12:39:30 AM
>> To: kris; tls@ietf.org
>> Subject: draft-kwiatkowski-tls-ecdhe-mlkem and P-384
>>  
>> Hello,
>>
>> What's the situation with other groups for TLS 1.3?
>> Specifically, are there any plans to specify SecP384r1MLKEM1024?
>>
>> As mentioned in multiple emails already, high security system
>> already have a strict requirement to use P-384 curve exclusively.
>> Similarly, for post-quantum resistance they will be required
>> to use ML-KEM-1024.
>>
>> Will you add it to the draft, or should we start work on a
>> separate one that defines those hybrid algorithms?
>

-- 
Regards,
Alicja (nee Hubert) Kario
Principal Quality Engineer, RHEL Crypto team
Web: www.cz.redhat.com
Red Hat Czech s.r.o., Purkyňova 115, 612 00, Brno, Czech Republic