Re: [TLS] Adoption call for draft-sy-tls-resumption-group

Victor Vasiliev <vasilvv@google.com> Fri, 26 April 2019 06:46 UTC

Return-Path: <vasilvv@google.com>
X-Original-To: tls@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: tls@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A3C01200BA for <tls@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 25 Apr 2019 23:46:06 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -17.5
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xT4dO9Eqy3CT for <tls@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 25 Apr 2019 23:46:04 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-lj1-x22e.google.com (mail-lj1-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8ED15120106 for <TLS@ietf.org>; Thu, 25 Apr 2019 23:46:03 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-lj1-x22e.google.com with SMTP id y6so1841738ljd.12 for <TLS@ietf.org>; Thu, 25 Apr 2019 23:46:03 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=qPa6qA4zSYe27l+e/Q99MUqesoMLEJ6q5wCvGD2rzXY=; b=qfHfVFAj4T1WYDlscwUxsqGiYzkHGqevZ398NQ0QY1GtFd36WfMBZrFPAHl7ek7GYO qrBaFU/o+LUeJRp0Ic1+3fQwcztjcPZl6z9XnKqF0xKG82leXKpvLnujkMyW43mJsV57 vHR0r94F4a85KeQ28MTs3lhzmX2zZFY7Bs4/vd0umSYMaSiW5gKL9XPQxBMD+G7KDroy GZzspUFVnchpWfAzxoOqd2E+OGP1gsQXg3yvesIllU044Jibamjs9hmrq37o4vimoEos r6F+U6dtPlFsaKZ7oKrTONCw3/4R8PRDWPAl4NuVsDa+vYlZ7tqttsalE/+KIUU32zg6 pvCg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=qPa6qA4zSYe27l+e/Q99MUqesoMLEJ6q5wCvGD2rzXY=; b=kHjxHyBDldjoYuDhn7mlVFKQRKRQ4R/rT//8PVBU/rrTErR64mNeWcCV1l2+7Ti8Zr ybiKqlgF48GF+bAvQrw6AOKzKSzmGL3w1MQTNCCJFkzRylk8VRBtSw4UAbXHCJpZ/snu fpYf69tPOiUSWzdFgDfag8BjiBpC4/mGf/kWDD+eBXmphmgpy+S47Gk2selXxN02J8YS En6aIgwFBBKw/XkblKVLOI8aEFaGGGDv/OaWKfXLixM3Sr5Q6ebatSSZyylO3XCwvgpi 0HEOR909ik7qIH4fF715iHthtQ5m3qbbPxd457xsVfolGtwgmdxFIo3N1ZH2PdSob2eM g3JA==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVQ3SpxXgIueUAHeWrh4Bf1qBtmkd3qiHxOuPChXK1b826UrO2N cZY+moequKgJu1N5KV4v547dbifPdScQSyxYkPeJk5hiFhA=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzx1TvAPg3eJ3kjIDa9nbNzCf2kyMDIKpo2W527e6jVEEWp8XpDFMK+Js0ilmbnv1k7no7e/tcpShdJW6R0MgY=
X-Received: by 2002:a2e:8496:: with SMTP id b22mr4302038ljh.9.1556261161068; Thu, 25 Apr 2019 23:46:01 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <4f21da8a-a30c-4255-9400-aab3a599fb9b@www.fastmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <4f21da8a-a30c-4255-9400-aab3a599fb9b@www.fastmail.com>
From: Victor Vasiliev <vasilvv@google.com>
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2019 02:45:49 -0400
Message-ID: <CAAZdMaf6Fs6fEQoF_uS63d2rMFZwbqsugz7O9weSDxgdOLNU=w@mail.gmail.com>
To: Christopher Wood <caw@heapingbits.net>
Cc: "TLS@ietf.org" <TLS@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000af59270587694987"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/yv79s_72YGXrXY333V4mzz5_3o4>
Subject: Re: [TLS] Adoption call for draft-sy-tls-resumption-group
X-BeenThere: tls@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "This is the mailing list for the Transport Layer Security working group of the IETF." <tls.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/tls>, <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/tls/>
List-Post: <mailto:tls@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tls>, <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2019 06:46:06 -0000

Hello everyone,

I believe that the problem this draft addresses is important, and I believe
the working group should take on this work.

For various operational reasons, websites often use different IPs for
different resources they need to fetch.  Resumption across different SNI
values could allow them to use 0-RTT, reducing penalty for new connections
they have to make.

A particular case I want to address is a situation when there is a CDN (say
cdn.example.com) that has multiple shards (say shard101.cdn.example.com and
shard102.cdn.example.com), and the client gets load balanced to a specific
shard based on requested resource.  In the current situation, unless
shard101 and shard102 share the same physical IP, they'd have to pay
connection startup cost for each request.  Cross-domain resumption would
allow 0-RTT to the second shard accessed, provided all shards have a
wildcard certificate.

>From the technical standpoint, I agree with Martin that a NewSessionTicket
extension would be a better fit, but this is something that we can figure
out later without much trouble.

The policy questions (when *should* the client resume?) are more difficult
here, and there are multiple aspects to this.  One is, as Martin pointed
out, is clarifying the notion of server identity from application
perspective in cross-domain scenario.  Another is ensuring that the
linkability properties are not altered in ways we don't understand.  On the
surface, one can argue that this is semantically the same procedure as
HTTP/2 connection pooling, but without the IP match requirement.  This is
good, because we can build on the analysis of an existing mechanism.
Still, in practice, this might open us up to attacks that with the IP match
were impractical.  We should ensure that the document describes things
we've learned from connection pooling, too.

As I've said before, I am happy to help with this draft.

  -- Victor.

On Fri, Apr 12, 2019 at 7:36 PM Christopher Wood <caw@heapingbits.net>
wrote:

> At TLS@IETF104, there was interest in the room to adopt
> draft-sy-tls-resumption-group as a WG item. The draft can be found here:
>
>     https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-sy-tls-resumption-group/
>
> This email starts the call for adoption. It will run until April 26, 2019.
> Please indicate whether or not you would like to see this draft
> adopted.
>
> Thanks,
> Chris, Joe, and Sean
>
> _______________________________________________
> TLS mailing list
> TLS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tls
>