[TLS] Re: WG Last Call: draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-05 (Ends 2025-11-26)

John Mattsson <john.mattsson@ericsson.com> Mon, 01 December 2025 06:40 UTC

Return-Path: <john.mattsson@ericsson.com>
X-Original-To: tls@mail2.ietf.org
Delivered-To: tls@mail2.ietf.org
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail2.ietf.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AFBD92FC650 for <tls@mail2.ietf.org>; Sun, 30 Nov 2025 22:40:10 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at ietf.org
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.096
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.096 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_RPBL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_VALIDITY_SAFE_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: mail2.ietf.org (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com
Received: from mail2.ietf.org ([166.84.6.31]) by localhost (mail2.ietf.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9Zv3ccKQ9nDG for <tls@mail2.ietf.org>; Sun, 30 Nov 2025 22:40:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: from AM0PR83CU005.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-westeuropeazon11010046.outbound.protection.outlook.com [52.101.69.46]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-384) server-signature ECDSA (P-256) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by mail2.ietf.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A534292FC649 for <tls@ietf.org>; Sun, 30 Nov 2025 22:40:09 -0800 (PST)
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector10001; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=V77cho6SrCnPqsc/dCAEKmn7ENXXbbnowxEt6XKeX8gydMX7SuKaK07FJxgbxtJSt4jt16D8+XO3N1n5im+B8KBHImne0o/AlyF1MtL0nVIYXjtAlf/CgKBfDT+UP5M5tdgVrSISkPwf20eIu1cJ5LAkKpaJwrE7L3geDK5EST+WxG5zxV2buAZcXq39eZz/UOi65Mai8e9g6Di64QRArs/wqP/WTsaPeiKewEik9e8PETb9IQuvJIeMt/o6CDupNt5UxIABRivd+J0MsU10C7s19zb8XCtqMsg1O5b7sqmm/dyomz+b3QeTYE6wa6xhwktQsgmXPeXHTKENy1Lnpw==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector10001; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-ChunkCount:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-0:X-MS-Exchange-AntiSpam-MessageData-1; bh=EkSckmQE+lsvooKTyn5nw0qX5QXvK8Xutz5PYG7VQ5I=; b=vfrazq0vSXTCksP/wBXZ7Ugtpoopo7M55zQsPvKtfc8VH0FDC2LN3/AmJTm6FIHfUUhWPNaeRxKsnCqugzlLfC+2+Qhm6Ri3oPMdX5K6zwaLZt5/bWUC1KH/RaMq+2yOKLX4W9sdhVK/FzfCuMqBd5yQY3eQTSaVh9l3f7pmJg2l13+ilEBQ0Rj9NGg+yL3UaXBfeyV7DmC/jfdTuPxI2mAUlxImx3Mnr9hUJHHNWUCG/FrDxfdbC5kXlFDvUNmlCaaploK+8WLwJ+THyx6aE81w4b+3mTrYxH/T7Ryub/FQHxXHQ/yHZyAT/Vbn9pJjnAMl3pqav5yH+c6FOfEsag==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=ericsson.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=ericsson.com; dkim=pass header.d=ericsson.com; arc=none
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ericsson.com; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=EkSckmQE+lsvooKTyn5nw0qX5QXvK8Xutz5PYG7VQ5I=; b=jgcXmrtu/Kmy1KAAHbYUISz6Oto8RifJ2t+Ty7RKXcIeelzZFuhBR6YqQGifwi72UbdFXIXYCoJa7KLJpb5/tF8U/5wadUtxmwK6Fe4skFs1tv24GAYI/2wLYbzM9JXRGfPyNfjTY5IoUu4noNhYyblONftChRIfuxub8r1x8FzFgIahftkfqR4iNGRPGL7YdTfzMl1eg4/PnqCBWo/qbffihuhg7xjdUGzjM+F35dg/j9qVBwMLil369OMSPIOyVGs45fXlBck18nQlfxOJhT0qaHwXU9y1vf5wu5T9+ZkqHIVnuGdTmvqwXL9dKyFSxcyurxrduI1kauwPhYq6og==
Received: from GVXPR07MB9678.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:150:114::10) by AM8PR07MB7652.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (2603:10a6:20b:24c::20) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.9366.17; Mon, 1 Dec 2025 06:40:07 +0000
Received: from GVXPR07MB9678.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::bcf3:3f45:888e:a4b8]) by GVXPR07MB9678.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::bcf3:3f45:888e:a4b8%3]) with mapi id 15.20.9366.012; Mon, 1 Dec 2025 06:40:07 +0000
From: John Mattsson <john.mattsson@ericsson.com>
To: "Salz, Rich" <rsalz@akamai.com>, John Mattsson <john.mattsson=40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, Muhammad Usama Sardar <muhammad_usama.sardar@tu-dresden.de>, Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com>, "tls@ietf.org" <tls@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [TLS] Re: WG Last Call: draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-05 (Ends 2025-11-26)
Thread-Index: AQHcYowSZf3Y1NSx50mpYS7SLhMspw==
Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2025 06:40:07 +0000
Message-ID: <GVXPR07MB967838DDA4B4C14DA48B239489DBA@GVXPR07MB9678.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-GB
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-ms-reactions: allow
authentication-results: dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;dmarc=none action=none header.from=ericsson.com;
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: GVXPR07MB9678:EE_|AM8PR07MB7652:EE_
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 015eeba4-9b8e-4f87-ae33-08de30a477df
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-ms-exchange-antispam-relay: 0
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;ARA:13230040|376014|366016|1800799024|8096899003|38070700021|7053199007;
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 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
x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255;CTRY:;LANG:en;SCL:1;SRV:;IPV:NLI;SFV:NSPM;H:GVXPR07MB9678.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com;PTR:;CAT:NONE;SFS:(13230040)(376014)(366016)(1800799024)(8096899003)(38070700021)(7053199007);DIR:OUT;SFP:1101;
x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1
x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: 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
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_GVXPR07MB967838DDA4B4C14DA48B239489DBAGVXPR07MB9678eurp_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: ericsson.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: GVXPR07MB9678.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 015eeba4-9b8e-4f87-ae33-08de30a477df
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 01 Dec 2025 06:40:07.6911 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 92e84ceb-fbfd-47ab-be52-080c6b87953f
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: bXF9C6Ih4nZrg+Mxq1gzWdNR1SjD0gUZlZ1nMeGXCPWI1aNS6ms3BOnZJwVcR0h7e4fyb9ovnqTutYQmqcwYzxS2PfESM7vw+NGdYdYRqVM=
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: AM8PR07MB7652
Message-ID-Hash: TF6BRQSEOARRQ32LTO2ERCZR4MLAAXWS
X-Message-ID-Hash: TF6BRQSEOARRQ32LTO2ERCZR4MLAAXWS
X-MailFrom: john.mattsson@ericsson.com
X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tls.ietf.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header
X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.9rc6
Precedence: list
Subject: [TLS] Re: WG Last Call: draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-05 (Ends 2025-11-26)
List-Id: "This is the mailing list for the Transport Layer Security working group of the IETF." <tls.ietf.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tls/zDRSvEUhtUrUiopoHTfgLWqqYcY>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/tls>
List-Help: <mailto:tls-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Owner: <mailto:tls-owner@ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:tls@ietf.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:tls-join@ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:tls-leave@ietf.org>

Hi,

RFC 2026 defines what an Internet Standard is, but it does not restrict the plain English word “standard” to that meaning. RFCs routinely use “standard” to refer to external standards. When the intent is specifically an Internet standard or standards track, the text normally says so explicitly.

So an unqualified “standard” can certainly refer to an external standard. See e.g., BCP 166.

Cheers,
John Preuß Mattsson

From: Salz, Rich <rsalz@akamai.com>
Date: Sunday, 30 November 2025 at 19:56
To: John Mattsson <john.mattsson=40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, Muhammad Usama Sardar <muhammad_usama.sardar@tu-dresden.de>, Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com>, tls@ietf.org <tls@ietf.org>
Subject: [TLS] Re: WG Last Call: draft-ietf-tls-mlkem-05 (Ends 2025-11-26)



  *
If you interpret the word “standard” as defined in United Nations A-HRC-53-42 ...

This is wrong.

Within the IETF, interpret the word standard as defined in RFC 2026 etc.