Re: [Tools-discuss] Weird messages from IETF/Google Mailservers (WG: PALS WG Adoption poll draft-schmutzer-pals-ple)

Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de> Thu, 01 June 2023 14:12 UTC

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Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2023 16:12:31 +0200
From: Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de>
To: N.Leymann@telekom.de
Cc: wgchairs@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [Tools-discuss] Weird messages from IETF/Google Mailservers (WG: PALS WG Adoption poll draft-schmutzer-pals-ple)
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Cc'ing tools-discuss.

This has been going on with gmail for at least a year. I can try to find the first
times i reported this to tools-discuss.

Please complain with the ART email folks. It is the IETF that standardized all those
email "security" mechanisms such DMARC that google is now using to effectively make
email unusable for many people (and this is primarily what i heard from outside the IETF).

As you can see, even well-meaning and well financed organizations
such as the IETF tools team takes year(s?) to adopt all these "security" mechanisms,
(waiting for new mailman to get deployed in IETF toold, i guess.). So there is
even a disconnet between our standards work and the operational results in our
own organization.

And then there are millions of not-financed-at-all email installations. Such as the one
from my university i have been using for hmm... 38 years now without problems until last year.
Who is even going to explain to those millions of email installations how all those email security
mechanisms work, and what to do to configure/install them.

I for once have seen a good presentation summarizing these aspects from an operator
perspective, and i don't have the time to read through all those email security RFCs.
So, if someone knows e.g.: a NANOG or other more operator friendly material, i'd appreciate
pointers.

Cheers
    Toerless

On Thu, Jun 01, 2023 at 09:00:06AM +0000, N.Leymann@telekom.de wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Am I the only one getting weird messages from IETF/Google Mail Servers? 
> Looks like that the expansion of an alias caused the problem.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Nic
> 
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Mail Delivery System <MAILER-DAEMON@ietfa.amsl.com> 
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 1. Juni 2023 10:50
> An: Leymann, Nicolai
> Betreff: Unzustellbar: PALS WG Adoption poll draft-schmutzer-pals-ple
> 
> This is the mail system at host ietfa.amsl.com.
> 
> I'm sorry to have to inform you that your message could not be delivered to one or more recipients. It's attached below.
> 
> For further assistance, please send mail to postmaster.
> 
> If you do so, please include this problem report. You can delete your own text from the attached returned message.
> 
>                    The mail system
> 
> <agmalis@gmail.com> (expanded from <expand-pals-chairs@virtual.ietf.org>): host
>     gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com[2607:f8b0:4023:c06::1b] said: 550-5.7.26 This
>     mail is unauthenticated, which poses a security risk to the 550-5.7.26
>     sender and Gmail users, and has been blocked. The sender must 550-5.7.26
>     authenticate with at least one of SPF or DKIM. For this message, 550-5.7.26
>     DKIM checks did not pass and SPF check for [telekom.de] did not pass
>     550-5.7.26 with ip: [2001:559:c4c7::100]. The sender should visit
>     550-5.7.26  https://support.google.com/mail/answer/81126#authentication for
>     550 5.7.26 instructions on setting up authentication.
>     g9-20020a17090ace8900b00246fe4e326dsi753688pju.81 - gsmtp (in reply to end
>     of DATA command)
> 
> <david.sinicrope@gmail.com> (expanded from
>     <expand-pals-chairs@virtual.ietf.org>): host
>     gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com[2607:f8b0:4023:c06::1b] said: 550-5.7.26 This
>     mail is unauthenticated, which poses a security risk to the 550-5.7.26
>     sender and Gmail users, and has been blocked. The sender must 550-5.7.26
>     authenticate with at least one of SPF or DKIM. For this message, 550-5.7.26
>     DKIM checks did not pass and SPF check for [telekom.de] did not pass
>     550-5.7.26 with ip: [2001:559:c4c7::100]. The sender should visit
>     550-5.7.26  https://support.google.com/mail/answer/81126#authentication for
>     550 5.7.26 instructions on setting up authentication.
>     g9-20020a17090ace8900b00246fe4e326dsi753688pju.81 - gsmtp (in reply to end
>     of DATA command)
> 
> <stewart.bryant@gmail.com> (expanded from
>     <expand-pals-chairs@virtual.ietf.org>): host
>     gmail-smtp-in.l.google.com[2607:f8b0:4023:c06::1b] said: 550-5.7.26 This
>     mail is unauthenticated, which poses a security risk to the 550-5.7.26
>     sender and Gmail users, and has been blocked. The sender must 550-5.7.26
>     authenticate with at least one of SPF or DKIM. For this message, 550-5.7.26
>     DKIM checks did not pass and SPF check for [telekom.de] did not pass
>     550-5.7.26 with ip: [2001:559:c4c7::100]. The sender should visit
>     550-5.7.26  https://support.google.com/mail/answer/81126#authentication for
>     550 5.7.26 instructions on setting up authentication.
>     g9-20020a17090ace8900b00246fe4e326dsi753688pju.81 - gsmtp (in reply to end
>     of DATA command)

-- 
---
tte@cs.fau.de