[Tools-discuss] Email confirmation of IPR disclosures (Was: Document Action: 'Secure Shell (SSH) Key Exchange Method Using Hybrid Streamlined NTRU Prime sntrup761 and X25519 with SHA-512: sntrup761x25519-sha512' to Informational RFC (draft-ietf-sshm-ntruprime-ssh-06.txt))

[Jay Daley <[e-mail]>]

Simon

(cc list adjusted)

> On 2 Oct 2025, at 20:47, Simon Josefsson <simon=[e-mail]> wrote:
> 
> Jay,
> 
> Could you improve the process to require a e-mail verification to
> mitigate falsely identified submissions?  I recall this has happened
> before, attributing IPR disclosures to someone else.

This improvement has been on the todo list for a while but it’s a fairly low priority as examples of misuse are extremely rare and nearly always caught at submission time or very soon after.

	https://github.com/ietf-tools/datatracker/issues/8106

We’re also applying heightened scrutiny to new disclosures.

> To improve transparency, how about publishing logs for the submission
> (web server logs or full e-mail headers), so that everyone is able to
> assess the submission.

Possible but I would like to hear from more people about this and I will need to check with our lawyers.

> If we do accept anonymous non-verified submissions, I'm not sure it make
> sense to announce these self-proclaimed identities as prominently as we
> do today?

I don’t know what you mean by "as prominently as we do today" nor what you consider a reasonable alternative?

Jay

> 
> /Simon
> 
> Jay Daley <[e-mail]> writes:
> 
>> Dan, Stephen
>> 
>> When someone creates an IPR disclosure they provide the subject, which
>> is the title you see at the top.  In this case this was a fake
>> disclosure about a presumably fake statement and the "objectively
>> false" refers to the disclosure not the statement. However, due to the
>> terseness of that message, it gives an incorrect impression that a
>> statement was made that is objectively false, when it actually means
>> that the disclosure was false.
>> 
>> The policy for removing objectively false disclosures [1] is fairly
>> new (2020) and from memory has only been used twice to date.
>> 
>> As a result of the feedback in this thread, I will adjust our process
>> behind it to include removing the subject entirely.
>> 
>> Jay
>> 
>> [1]
>> https://www.ietf.org/media/documents/IETF_LLC_Objectively_False_IPR_Disclosure_Policy_2020-06-23.pdf
>> 
>>> On 2 Oct 2025, at 11:56, D. J. Bernstein <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> IETF LLC Executive Director writes:
>>>> As others pointed out, a simple "please change this as it gives a
>>>> false impression" would have sufficed
>>> 
>>> "Impression"?
>>> 
>>> You posted the following statement and kept it online for most of a
>>> year: "Daniel J. Bernstein's Statement about IPR related to
>>> draft-josefsson-ntruprime-streamlined and draft-josefsson-ntruprime-ssh
>>> belonging to Panasonic Corp [line break and different font:] This IPR
>>> disclosure was removed as objectively false."
>>> 
>>> Your statement claims that I had filed a false IPR statement. Your
>>> statement is objectively false. That IPR statement was not from me.
>>> 
>>> You created your false statement by editing the original forged IPR
>>> statement. You knew at that time that the IPR statement was forged. You
>>> knew at that time that your statement was false. Your statement
>>> attributes to me a lack of ability in my profession.
>>> 
>>> Please issue a clear and specific apology this week.
>>> 
>>> ---D. J. Bernstein

-- 
Jay Daley
IETF Executive Director
[e-mail]