IETF Logo Mail Archive

Re: [Trans] DNSSEC also needs CT

Ben Laurie <benl@google.com> Tue, 13 May 2014 15:40 UTC

Return-Path: <benl@google.com>
X-Original-To: trans@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: trans@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 665A51A010A for <trans@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 13 May 2014 08:40:46 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.03
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.03 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.651, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YLGeE7S1p8Fg for <trans@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 13 May 2014 08:40:44 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-vc0-x22d.google.com (mail-vc0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c03::22d]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93B981A0102 for <trans@ietf.org>; Tue, 13 May 2014 08:40:44 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-vc0-f173.google.com with SMTP id il7so695736vcb.4 for <trans@ietf.org>; Tue, 13 May 2014 08:40:38 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=DMyetM2s/vW42hd7tI1AAuZVFaaz9K86IBMASOf98iY=; b=X7WCzru0GBJvTTetGEdiJBQfoaeL+AEPndOwcu4a+RLRe5V9GpZyd4YxCqBYzd/VGz G/tkTmIByV5dkSrFqXISf3Y6Q1ItnCEQjGCsNoiqH5Bsc8ej4UJvHy2578yXZf9j6fvw 8SQcoieRas8MBQAaJ/z5+vi49fdCTcv0WDg0CxKa1uBKejFAMmE+87kPtRqNRKJLZvmy vUQYDpbT36R36gen9HWrouxVM8av3ovvPCFQerHbOiPM0QDdtDjCvJUXXmBNlO2FE0Ip QoV6o5+IfnW/oTn/mPDJe3/0YI9Wce/NYMB9bneLTzq+EOs6JFqcaiqnz+YioVIUEweI SAOg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=DMyetM2s/vW42hd7tI1AAuZVFaaz9K86IBMASOf98iY=; b=Ge5Q2oQOhe2SGrWfnDOHOUMZMGK8PY4CA2AuPD8sOX2umZUoJZ4HMVP9ZVxXjnZG9I +BkN3/JXU50H9OXO3QMsr7NbiUtTaoBNolvXNonfzXQ6H89B7ioemA68nd9vIuUGiwSR b84NBOncRMoO2S6yKbJTnDMjcHlg7Y/kX8rpzwMGQ2eGNbJWSrKbi+EL8AtjYFBzDU5z OMW0gjqQhFJS7GOqH4WXZNM5c3kmBAd74KdIgJQLjcE+tv66JnMvY4mGy+7yUgep+ZAL Bxjw3t1EIXwBaI40ZoxlxXpQzhXHq6nxnfdVhJG26OBoZ7m5ZQ+SmPlO1P4lo3BgMvWv vA2w==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQlWhde9ZONUCtHeQYsKPedV3GUP16s0AojP2UD9z6ccB4D2xSQmRObU//LDqVTx0RxumSZY
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-Received: by 10.58.122.164 with SMTP id lt4mr29970575veb.2.1399995637981; Tue, 13 May 2014 08:40:37 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.52.252.97 with HTTP; Tue, 13 May 2014 08:40:37 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <alpine.LFD.2.10.1405131128150.25023@bofh.nohats.ca>
References: <CAK3OfOjiL2DTJPH3CaAjg8YGrrwN56SgQ+DnqPXx4MLbgXQN+A@mail.gmail.com> <alpine.LFD.2.10.1405101722240.897@bofh.nohats.ca> <CABrd9ST7K-7RGwGD2G+kDcVSceC2ZJ-5Tz2tdp5NWa3cqBK+-w@mail.gmail.com> <CAOe4Ui=nqmCfjBYNE2CJtEs1jnbavpY4Dv-T3FRDdAwAA2dScg@mail.gmail.com> <CAK3OfOiYMJkXVR+QsCzEV0ir6u53coJz0b-JdGGD5bTTz5YcMg@mail.gmail.com> <CAOe4Ui=u0fkm9_nuXx_6gpH6jHM5pBvzjzru9O8y3bpLkA0qmw@mail.gmail.com> <CAK3OfOi6y=QAMXe_2axiavxwR5nS2Uv8SM4JxQHsvEKbUyNGCA@mail.gmail.com> <CAOe4Uimvc6e6u=fJjM1-iaOTepA33Sx5CBjMV9dB8sSLqtZoWA@mail.gmail.com> <CAK3OfOhdhWdGvvhuaGyE_p5kLy0ZX-V5sAXfoLGP_8d8vPJDgg@mail.gmail.com> <CAOe4Uik+fjM4wTVBiFxphVZAwVYBPgd1a9xUyUBMSFy30SWNLg@mail.gmail.com> <CAK3OfOiC+5+s2UtSEP788W23tHq6VQSQfMsUboUp16L-27zsvQ@mail.gmail.com> <CABrd9STYxmK6gg7a5wDtejdc_Y0aD9hwQkHpFu3HbxVbMZDQHQ@mail.gmail.com> <alpine.LFD.2.10.1405130948160.25023@bofh.nohats.ca> <CABrd9SSiHfyvPxgYrDZ_idE+UGcUXVFx3BGcc2qp+t+nmuJwLw@mail.gmail.com> <alpine.LFD.2.10.1405131128150.25023@bofh.nohats.ca>
Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 16:40:37 +0100
Message-ID: <CABrd9SStajEd9vDB8MrcosFiTYhAtnRMCY8CnOeuhPF16PAAPg@mail.gmail.com>
From: Ben Laurie <benl@google.com>
To: Paul Wouters <paul@nohats.ca>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/trans/kuHvvEEtSz17txBg1gAWviTvqZ8
Cc: "trans@ietf.org" <trans@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Trans] DNSSEC also needs CT
X-BeenThere: trans@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Public Notary Transparency working group discussion list <trans.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/trans>, <mailto:trans-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/trans/>
List-Post: <mailto:trans@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:trans-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/trans>, <mailto:trans-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 13 May 2014 15:40:46 -0000

On 13 May 2014 16:33, Paul Wouters <paul@nohats.ca> wrote:
> On Tue, 13 May 2014, Ben Laurie wrote:
>
>> OK, good point: zone cuts need to also be verified.
>>
>>> The other case is injection of a custom DS RRset. How would we tell the
>>> difference between the legitimate zone owner adding a DS record or an
>>> attacker/parent zone owner adding one?
>>
>>
>> The legitimate owner can tell - that's the point, right?
>
>
> How does that help protect a non-owner user of someone's site being
> attacked with a targetted attack? If I don't run victim.com, and I am
> just a visitor of victim.com, but only I am given rogue DNSSEC records,
> how can I tell something is wrong? I would go to the public log and see
> the DS I received is not in there?

Right, exactly.

>
> (I'm late in this discussion, so I wouldn't know how this gets
>  authenticated by the consumer and the victim.com's owner, especially
>  if the parent could do a hostile takeover)
>
> Paul



-- 
Certificate Transparency is hiring! Let me know if you're interested.

v2.23.0 | Report a Bug | By Email