Re: [trill] WG LC on draft-ietf-trill-over-ip-14.txt

Re: [trill] WG LC on draft-ietf-trill-over-ip-14.txt - Consensus reached

Joe Touch <touch@strayalpha.com> Mon, 19 February 2018 21:40 UTC

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From: Joe Touch <touch@strayalpha.com>
In-Reply-To: <03b401d3a9c5$8ebe3d40$ac3ab7c0$@ndzh.com>
Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2018 13:40:20 -0800
Cc: trill IETF mailing list <trill@ietf.org>, trill-chairs@ietf.org, Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>
Message-Id: <612C70FE-6C3E-4E31-A3E6-0FF7446EBD2A@strayalpha.com>
References: <03b401d3a9c5$8ebe3d40$ac3ab7c0$@ndzh.com>
To: Susan Hares <shares@ndzh.com>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/trill/fR9T3Pt82P1T4vINDH-kTeyYvVw>
Subject: Re: [trill] WG LC on draft-ietf-trill-over-ip-14.txt - Consensus reached
Precedence: list

FWIW:

> On Feb 19, 2018, at 1:06 PM, Susan Hares <shares@ndzh.com> wrote:
> 
> Greetings: 
>  
> Thank you for your comments on the draft-ietfd-trill-over-ip-xx.txt   The WG has reached consensus on the draft, and it will be sent forward to the IESG. 
>  
> I want to thank Magnus Westlund, Ines Robles, and Joe Touch for their targeted reviews.  
>  
> Joe asked two important questions that I want to chat about in announcing the result.  
> 1)      Why IPSEC + TCP/UDP tunnels 
> 2)      Why the name TRILL over IP? – it is really TRILL over IP enabled Transport port protocols 
>  
>  
> During this WG LC, I spent time looking back into my notes to check our evaluation of the alternatives GRE, TLS, or DLTS.  I also asked the  WG leadership team (Jon, Sue, and Donald with Alia Atlas help) to discuss these points that Joe raised.     Here’s what I found. 
>  
> 1)      Why IPSEC and TCP/UDP tunnels
>  
> After I walked through the WG archives, I found that over several IETFs we debated TLS, DTLS, and GRE.   Our most substantive debate was at IETF 91.   The WG had settle on utilizing GRE, TLS, or DLTS – until hardware vendors implementing TRILL came to chat with the WG at IETF 91.   The hardware vendors asked that we would utilize IPSEC and higher layer tunnels (TCP/UDP) so that TRILL switches could operate at line speed using these IPSEC processing chips off board.  The WG decided to listen to vendor creating and deploying TRILL capable devices. 
>  
> The hardware vendors reasoning still seems valid to the WG chairs and the WGs.   If in the future hardware comes up with TLS, DTLS or GRE at Ethernet switch line rates and vendors want a TRILL product with these tunnels, I’m sure that a Routing AD or  the RTGWG draft will sponsor such a draft.  

https://supportforums.cisco.com/t5/lan-switching-and-routing/3850-gre-support-in-hardware/td-p/2402487 <https://supportforums.cisco.com/t5/lan-switching-and-routing/3850-gre-support-in-hardware/td-p/2402487>

https://www.cavium.com/pdfFiles/Nitrox_III_PB_Rev1.0.pdf <https://www.cavium.com/pdfFiles/Nitrox_III_PB_Rev1.0.pdf>

> 
> 2)      Is the name TRILL over IP valid? 
>  
> Now as to the name, Joe was correct the name should be changed since it is really TRILL over IPSEC + Transport.   Donald’s make the change to the title of the document, and in the document.   

“IP transport” implies using IP as a tunneling layer, which is not part of this document’s proposed approach.

Further, the description of how it interacts with TCP is incoherent to anyone familiar with TCP transport (“slicing” packets and claiming to place them directly into TCP payloads).

Joe

[trill] WG LC on draft-ietf-trill-over-ip-14.txt … Susan Hares
Re: [trill] WG LC on draft-ietf-trill-over-ip-14.… Joe Touch
Re: [trill] WG LC on draft-ietf-trill-over-ip-14.… Susan Hares
Re: [trill] WG LC on draft-ietf-trill-over-ip-14.… Joe Touch