Re: [Tsv-art] [Last-Call] Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-integrity-06
Joe Touch <touch@strayalpha.com> Thu, 29 July 2021 04:41 UTC
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From: Joe Touch <touch@strayalpha.com>
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Date: Wed, 28 Jul 2021 21:41:06 -0700
Cc: tsv-art@ietf.org, draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-integrity.all@ietf.org, sfc@ietf.org, last-call@ietf.org
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To: tirumal reddy <kondtir@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [Tsv-art] [Last-Call] Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-sfc-nsh-integrity-06
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Insufficient. > On Jul 28, 2021, at 7:09 AM, tirumal reddy <kondtir@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Thanks Joseph for the detailed comment and explanation. We plan to add the following text to address the issue: > > Note that the term “transport encapsulation” used in this document is equivalent to the term “tunnel encapsulation” used In [ietf-intarea-tunnel]. > > Cheers, > -Tiru > >> On Mon, 26 Jul 2021 at 10:34, Joseph Touch via Datatracker <noreply@ietf.org> wrote: >> Reviewer: Joseph Touch >> Review result: Not Ready >> >> This document has been reviewed as part of the transport area review team's >> ongoing effort to review key IETF documents. These comments were written >> primarily for the transport area directors, but are copied to the document's >> authors and WG to allow them to address any issues raised and also to the IETF >> discussion list for information. >> >> When done at the time of IETF Last Call, the authors should consider this >> review as part of the last-call comments they receive. Please always CC >> tsv-art@ietf.org if you reply to or forward this review. >> >> It was very difficult to review this document for IETF transport protocol >> considerations. >> >> Although "transport encapsulation" is indicated repeatedly, it is never >> referred to directly or described either in this document or its citations. It >> appears to be using this term in the sense of RFC8300, which too never defines >> it, but uses examples that are more accurately referred to in the IETF as link >> layer protocols or either network or link tunnel protocols (IP in IP, GRE, >> VXLAN, Ethernet). >> >> Regardless of the fact that this confusion originates in RFC8300, it needs to >> be addressed here and corrected before this document can be reviewed to >> determine if there are any IETF transport area issues. >> >> The remainder of these notes provide detail of this issue. >> >> ----- >> >> The document refers back to RFC8300 to define the NSH itself; that document >> discusses transport issues just as vaguely (never mentioning a particular >> transport protocol), and when it discusses fragmentation, it refers to section >> 9 of a document (draft-ietf-rtgwg-dt-encap-02 from 2017) that had expired prior >> to the publication of RFC8300. Because transport fragmentation is, IMO, a >> normative issue, this should not have been permitted. >> >> Further, Section 9 of that draft incorrectly recommends reliance on ICMP >> feedback to address MTU failures when not under a single operator’s management. >> That was widely known even then to be insufficient due to blackholing; this had >> motivated PLPMTUD in RFC4821 a full decade earlier. RFC8300 compounds this >> error by simply asserting that the operator should ensure that ICMPs are not >> blocked, overlooking the need to address when this is not the case. >> >> This document cannot ignore that issue and simply refer to RFC8300 on this >> issue. >> >> Note that one of the only places an actual encapsulation protocol is mentioned >> is RFC8300, in which Section 5 mentions IP and Section 6.1 Table 1 describes >> VXLAN-GPE, GRE, and Ethernet – all of which are described as “transport >> encapsulation”. >> >> If, in fact, IETF transport protocols are being used, at some point the use of >> an actual IETF transport protocol should be described (e.g., TCP, UDP, SCTP, >> DCCP). At that point, the transport issues would be reviewable. As the document >> currently stands, it completely ignores such transport issues and should not >> proceed until this is addressed and re-reviewed. >> >> If instead, as I suspect, the term “transport encapsulation” actually refers to >> “network layer encapsulation” or “link layer encapsulation” and really implies >> some sort of tunnel, there would be no transport area issues to review unless >> that tunnel were to include a transport protocol as part of the layers of >> encapsulation. If that is the case, the document should be revised to replace >> the term “transport” with something that more accurately describes VXLAN-GPE, >> GRE, Ethernet, and IP encapsulation using IETF terminology. Note that >> draft-ietf-intarea-tunnels never uses the term “transport” except when >> referring to the use of IETF transport protocols as a tunnel layer, e.g. (i.e., >> the last sentence of Sec 8 of this doc is incorrect in implying otherwise). >> >> (I would also note that neither this doc nor RFC8300 define “transport >> encapsulation” in their terminology; even if they would, they should not >> attempt to define it in a way inconsistent with widespread use in the IETF). >> >> >> > -- > last-call mailing list > last-call@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/last-call
- [Tsv-art] Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-s… Joseph Touch via Datatracker
- Re: [Tsv-art] Tsvart last call review of draft-ie… tirumal reddy
- Re: [Tsv-art] [Last-Call] Tsvart last call review… Joe Touch
- Re: [Tsv-art] [Last-Call] Tsvart last call review… Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Tsv-art] [Last-Call] Tsvart last call review… Joseph Touch
- Re: [Tsv-art] [sfc] [Last-Call] Tsvart last call … Joel M. Halpern
- Re: [Tsv-art] [Last-Call] [sfc] Tsvart last call … Joseph Touch