Re: [Udp35] Snowden and SPUD

Eliot Lear <> Mon, 20 July 2015 17:21 UTC

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To: Michael Welzl <>
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From: Eliot Lear <>
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Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2015 19:21:44 +0200
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Cc: Jana Iyengar <>, "" <>
Subject: Re: [Udp35] Snowden and SPUD
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On 7/20/15 7:16 PM, Michael Welzl wrote:
> oh and btw: your syn / synack assumes middleboxes trust end systems' tcps to act right - which is a point i made. will they immediately trust spud? why should they - just cause it's easy?  that's a weird reason to trust someone.

"Immediately" is a word I might have some difficulty with, but if the
semantics are such that there's at least a high likelihood that the host
will do the right thing, that makes getting UDP through firewalls
easier, and that's got to be worth something to both app developers and
their users (the people who have a relationship with the people who
manage the firewalls).

And so this brings me back to your earlier note: nobody wants to
duplicate ALL of TCP.  It's there.  Twice if you count SCTP ;-)  But
others ARE using UDP and might find their applications more deployable
if they layer them atop SPUD (which could yet come for free with DTLS).