Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-example-00
Peter Saint-Andre <stpeter@stpeter.im> Mon, 07 January 2013 18:35 UTC
Return-Path: <stpeter@stpeter.im>
X-Original-To: urn@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: urn@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2387C21F8994 for <urn@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:35:08 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -102.599
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AwGPuXgcZqVi for <urn@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:35:07 -0800 (PST)
Received: from stpeter.im (mailhost.stpeter.im [207.210.219.225]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4AEC621F882E for <urn@ietf.org>; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 10:35:06 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [10.129.24.67] (unknown [128.107.239.233]) (Authenticated sender: stpeter) by stpeter.im (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CBAF8404EB for <urn@ietf.org>; Mon, 7 Jan 2013 11:40:10 -0700 (MST)
Message-ID: <50EB1560.3060602@stpeter.im>
Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 11:35:12 -0700
From: Peter Saint-Andre <stpeter@stpeter.im>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.7; rv:17.0) Gecko/17.0 Thunderbird/17.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: urn@ietf.org
References: <201208162101.XAA08756@TR-Sys.de> <502DF26E.3050406@gmx.de>
In-Reply-To: <502DF26E.3050406@gmx.de>
X-Enigmail-Version: 1.4.6
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Subject: Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-example-00
X-BeenThere: urn@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: Revisions to URN RFCs <urn.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/urn>, <mailto:urn-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/urn>
List-Post: <mailto:urn@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:urn-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/urn>, <mailto:urn-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 18:35:08 -0000
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Old thread alert! On 8/17/12 1:27 AM, Julian Reschke wrote: > On 2012-08-16 23:01, Alfred � wrote: >> (no hat) >> >> On 08/16/2012, Keith Moore wrote: >>> On 08/14/2012 09:59 AM, Andy Newton wrote: >>>> Given that URNs are suppose to have permanence or persistence >>>> or whatever we are calling it today and a resolution >>>> mechanism, this desire to shoehorn identifiers that need to >>>> qualify as a URI into the URN system might be wrong. An >>>> identifier that must be a URI does not necessarily need or >>>> have all the properties to be a URN. Just an observation. >>> +1 >>> >>> URNs were intended to be _resource names_, i.e. names of >>> resources rather than merely unique identifiers. The >>> expectation was that such resources would generally be at least >>> potentially accessible over the network, and that it would be >>> possible to resolve such names to resource locations. >>> Everyone agreed that it should be possible to assign URNs to >>> resources that were not resolvable, or at least not resolvable >>> for the time being. But the idea that URNs are appropriate for >>> use whenever someone needed a unique non-resolvable identifier >>> that qualifies as a URI, always has struck me as bizarre and >>> contrary to the intended purpose of URNs. >>> >>> Keith >> >> +1 (for both statements) > > For the record: -1- > > urn:uuid: is used a lot in practice, and I simply don't see a > practical problem with it. > > Are you saying these shouldn't be URIs in the first place, or that > a separate URI scheme would have been ok (in which case those would > be URNs as well, just not using the "URN" URI scheme, no?). > >> I already have responded similarly to the seminal email wrt this >> topic (by Julian) that has motivated the creation this I-D (by >> PSA). >> >> The above notes seem to be properly backed the following >> excerpts from RFC 1737, "Requirements for Uniform Resource >> Names", Section 2, "Requirements for functional capabilities": >> >> | ... | It is intended that the lifetime of a URN be >> permanent. | ... | | URNs can be assigned to any >> resource that might conceivably | be available on the >> network, for hundreds of years. | ... >> >> IMO, the concepts of "example URNs" and "testing URNs" seem to >> be fundamentally incompatible with these requirements. For the >> latter, rapid software development for testing of namespace >> management and resolution systems can be furthered by "early >> reservation/assignment" of URN Namespace IDs by IANA (as soon as >> urn-nid mailing list and expert review "thumbs up" is obtained >> for a new URN Namespace proposal. > > The use case for reserved example URNs are specifications. It's > much better if people use one reserved for this purpose than making > up invalid ones (and that's what started this discussion). Exactly. Just as we have reserved domain names for specifications (RFC 2606), I think it might be useful to have a reserved URN namespace ID for specifications. I'd be happy to more carefully scope the Internet-Draft to reflect that narrow focus. Peter - -- Peter Saint-Andre https://stpeter.im/ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG/MacGPG2 v2.0.18 (Darwin) Comment: Using GnuPG with undefined - http://www.enigmail.net/ iEYEARECAAYFAlDrFWAACgkQNL8k5A2w/vxNBACfd5mSh3XTngTaHgBLiNLX07f1 VsUAoMgpbVZhAAJ4fo2FmAPwf4/WOn/g =jk5H -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
- [urn] Fwd: I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-examp… Peter Saint-Andre
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Andy Newton
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Peter Saint-Andre
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Alfred Hönes
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Julian Reschke
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Julian Reschke
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Julian Reschke
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Peter Saint-Andre
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Julian Reschke
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Julian Reschke
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Michael Mealling
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Julian Reschke
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Julian Reschke
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Julian Reschke
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Bjoern Hoehrmann
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Larry Masinter
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Larry Masinter
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Larry Masinter
- Re: [urn] I-D Action: draft-saintandre-urn-exampl… Keith Moore