Re: [v6ops] draft-ietf-v6ops-ula-usage-recommendations - work or abandon?

Victor Kuarsingh <victor@jvknet.com> Thu, 05 November 2015 01:39 UTC

Return-Path: <victor@jvknet.com>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C82021B360D for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 4 Nov 2015 17:39:07 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.9
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6U1Kf7EwwvHa for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 4 Nov 2015 17:39:04 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-qg0-x22d.google.com (mail-qg0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c04::22d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 63E1A1B35A0 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 4 Nov 2015 17:39:03 -0800 (PST)
Received: by qgeo38 with SMTP id o38so56114318qge.0 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 04 Nov 2015 17:39:02 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=jvknet_com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=subject:to:references:cc:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=797kTHYequ+OnSNM2GfSiUt9OZLiRFtEXcylRiw+T54=; b=mNGnZyhVoMgQi3g8tnM58Jx4trY+uxQCqcNP99CcZesWEZauZn4I78LAnFCOQZv8DG oCCzeNPv+IXMgj25xXG89d3m0wuxdAWgXC61bwF8dg1zSFN1KTpCLZCbxXbNR4RsDzYP hLqV1QekQzTs0+PQ6wI1LlGAxdfFh9FWcg96MsSIrPO3vaX5RHAMXRo/f9X/7Vte6wMC 6I2WWRt/A72U4padT4xcPz1PWPuKfYa0/FDlmvwyLO9qCAgwTQXZLWRw8Q3hofViLeJR 31CVgCq9zTeYm8Zp7ZQZXvEolLcMm+OFeWUVqZHR5LT7JSf+9dNmex1eKKxl1vaCj0d9 QlGw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:cc:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=797kTHYequ+OnSNM2GfSiUt9OZLiRFtEXcylRiw+T54=; b=nNwzup0Q9PPnLaaZ0qmVK/P/UXV1q2v/V4/urp35D5h6OLIU9QgQeVevFg24JKVHwz MKiJGUUOIHbd0jPJqXTaiegH7GFvskPFwuBl2HzUga4Tyt+71Gug5tWIQFTgFoVZLxg6 LBWMfa9YQWUHn1s/jHx5sp16W6w+84Rfx5/UZ9JfNivpb8KoFo8bmygnQ6CSnzoBZj+P H6PeBFpxCcyNJOEN6K6KNsxjyVxmaX/fxmOEJOWALmR38Fa+9xfcfblqeRz2p4xdh27D t8OCnvv7lh0qSLy5Jsc500SEE13Bk2gooQSpGVAiaAq45lcNLlHObfZZVwoXyy1jdVjY QEFg==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQl4IH07GZ4GminGqUPoSzWgiAzKI64BWmkUvYHzx/iqrW6GKXXmUmkdyNKmBHjFG3uGMhi6
X-Received: by 10.140.42.16 with SMTP id b16mr4983694qga.78.1446687542525; Wed, 04 Nov 2015 17:39:02 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [10.82.239.15] ([173.38.117.91]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id l33sm1063601qge.22.2015.11.04.17.39.00 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 04 Nov 2015 17:39:02 -0800 (PST)
To: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, Gert Doering <gert@space.net>, "Howard, Lee" <lee.howard@twcable.com>
References: <8AE0F17B87264D4CAC7DE0AA6C406F45C231921A@nkgeml506-mbx.china.huawei.com> <5637D854.2090203@bogus.com> <5637E84B.5090001@gmail.com> <5637EB69.1080608@umn.edu> <03358859-8078-489E-835D-3B4D324381BE@delong.com> <20151103204237.GJ70452@Space.Net> <CAO42Z2xen4gCfkJphZYKfjff5ZsEn_jOf5V16OtYOYNw2VKVAA@mail.gmail.com> <CAKD1Yr3Qn48eQ1Q4VovCsr_S2+RADRZKzi9qBDoh8G2w6Be+=g@mail.gmail.com> <20151104024731.0DCDE3BC3CBF@rock.dv.isc.org> <D25FB58B.C9B04%Lee.Howard@twcable.com> <20151104104208.GL70452@Space.Net> <563A8A76.1040304@gmail.com>
From: Victor Kuarsingh <victor@jvknet.com>
Message-ID: <563AB330.2020602@jvknet.com>
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2015 10:38:56 +0900
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.2.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <563A8A76.1040304@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/gIowgJu5wlUIWhqHaSg_c884Ttg>
Cc: v6ops list <v6ops@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] draft-ietf-v6ops-ula-usage-recommendations - work or abandon?
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/v6ops/>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2015 01:39:07 -0000


On 2015-11-05 7:45 AM, Brian E Carpenter wrote:
> But anyway: that is history now. IMHO we need text in the current 
> draft that not only states that ULA+NPTv6 has drawbacks, but actually 
> summarises them. And states that the IETF has not defined NAT66, and 
> summarises the additional drawbacks that ULA+NAT66 would bring. I 
> believe that most of the information about the drawbacks is already 
> documented, in RFC 6296 itself, RFC 4864, RFC 2993 and maybe 
> elsewehere. There is a good set of references in RFC 6296. However, I 
> don't think any of those references discusses the load balancer 
> drawback. It is mentioned in a different context at 
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7098#page-10. As it happens, that 
> describes a case where NPTv6 is definitely less harmful than NAPT. 
> (When we say NAT66, are we referring to NAT66 or NAPT66?) 
These are good points, however,

  how do we constructively provide objective information as to the 
technical drawbacks of a function which is not fully defined (re: 
NAT66).  I heard it noted this week that folks needed to differentiate 
between NAT66 and NAPT66 (as an example) at mics to then provide further 
input to the discussion (in v6ops).  This lack of definition (of NAT66 
and/or its variants) makes it difficult to make a full constructive 
argument (as we will need to keep repeating/expressing what we mean by 
NAT66 in each instance , or we just hope everyone has the same reference 
points - which is unlikely)

I can see how we can make the points against NPT66 since we at least 
have that documented.

regards,

Victor K



> Bing already indicated that the authors will add more or less what I 
> suggest. That's really the only change needed, IMHO. I'll save a 
> detailed re-review for the next draft. Brian 
> _______________________________________________ v6ops mailing list 
> v6ops@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops