Re: [v6ops] SLAAC renum: Problem Statement & Operational workarounds

Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com> Thu, 31 October 2019 19:44 UTC

Return-Path: <fgont@si6networks.com>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2039612006A for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 31 Oct 2019 12:44:39 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.899
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vY98ajxZMtTn for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 31 Oct 2019 12:44:37 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from fgont.go6lab.si (fgont.go6lab.si [91.239.96.14]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9FE29120018 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Thu, 31 Oct 2019 12:44:37 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.1.36] (unknown [177.27.208.83]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by fgont.go6lab.si (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C62BA8679F; Thu, 31 Oct 2019 20:44:32 +0100 (CET)
To: Philip Homburg <pch-v6ops-9@u-1.phicoh.com>, v6ops@ietf.org
References: <CAO42Z2yQ_6PT3nQrXGD-mKO1bjsW6V3jZ_2kNGC2x586EMiNZg@mail.gmail.com> <B53CE471-C6E8-4DC1-8A72-C6E23154544F@fugue.com> <m1iOk6q-0000IyC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net>
From: Fernando Gont <fgont@si6networks.com>
Openpgp: preference=signencrypt
Message-ID: <96c7ab64-0768-55f0-9d92-4574dbd8032c@si6networks.com>
Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2019 16:38:39 -0300
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <m1iOk6q-0000IyC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/tQZboP2yoWMmLjQF1veIIP1CbBE>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] SLAAC renum: Problem Statement & Operational workarounds
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/v6ops/>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2019 19:44:39 -0000

On 27/10/19 12:05, Philip Homburg wrote:
>> Indeed, this would also
>> not actually solve the problem.   At present, the ISPs are doing
>> something that is out of spec and causes problems.   If we fix this
>> by accommodating what they do, does that help, or does it just
>> encourage them to continue doing it?
> 
> At the moment, ISPs are doing something that sort of works in IPv4 because
> of NAT. It causes significant issues in IPv6.

Note that this is *one* of the network scenarios that may lead to this
problematic scenario.



> Of course, can we can tell ISPs that they are doing it wrong and that they
> should not deploy IPv6 until they have fixed their networks.
> 
> I would like to have IPv6 now. And if that requires some tweaks to deal with
> broken behavior then so be it.

Indeed. Besides, the patch increases robustness overall.


> 
>> If you Really Really want to be able to have the routers send out
>> RAs that deprecate the default route, and, as Mark is saying here,
>> to upgrade millions or perhaps billions of hosts, why not ask for
>> something thats a real improvement?
> 
> Because bundling features is a good way to ensure that nothing gets done.

Indeed.

Thanks,
-- 
Fernando Gont
SI6 Networks
e-mail: fgont@si6networks.com
PGP Fingerprint: 6666 31C6 D484 63B2 8FB1 E3C4 AE25 0D55 1D4E 7492