[v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses
Daryll Swer <contact@daryllswer.com> Wed, 14 August 2024 09:51 UTC
Return-Path: <contact@daryllswer.com>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3130C151091 for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 14 Aug 2024 02:51:53 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.106
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.106 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=daryllswer.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZFqxFJUdPnZf for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 14 Aug 2024 02:51:49 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pj1-x1033.google.com (mail-pj1-x1033.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::1033]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature ECDSA (P-256) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CDB7CC14F6F4 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 14 Aug 2024 02:51:48 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pj1-x1033.google.com with SMTP id 98e67ed59e1d1-2d1bb65e906so4247774a91.3 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 14 Aug 2024 02:51:48 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=daryllswer.com; s=google; t=1723629108; x=1724233908; darn=ietf.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=+T5C/2kwSedQ7sDlSOwTzvO/M/x1BribivaU5jw+ENY=; b=ALQjjSM5ORAVuBQ98wall3F/zXVQowTO/3H7keVK8N0yxyJIjwiB/5fy4Nmaq8Q0up J9xe/+snFs/yqdoEifp0c9UjW4uLKF6kPjSmzAzA9xj8pol2ls+YfD9hrnAvCjUEfVr+ llKyuWwCwmu3pr9wYyWu+oXAV4OHkrDvDsJjTJBrFoyGSOEVoCkrE5QH0t2nsziNvZuq 53IlaDwOEueUioGD2egV4KWLz4tgaSgsTHM2sOm4dDd3zJIGTLl4Ignc2FCRG6DV9Ugk thbgJGQVJ1iM9xwQl0NsmPdxnGbJU4s8yT1HyRBKU3MJvsFhHVgbOn+h5SCKpwKZpksq 3MLQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1723629108; x=1724233908; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=+T5C/2kwSedQ7sDlSOwTzvO/M/x1BribivaU5jw+ENY=; b=VoJze2z/EtYLKeGSZjXB3Tw3yOzyBUK8qXIaEHOCOgyf3MJKwMRtNnbJI5K3URKhTg iiQeHHX4SzCWB23WRqfNHuzd0baiYqWTkkr4i43M/uoh/gNEOu8A/mN2yKSQH6JHnxoU 8ApmFQzwpq9p6qwFpBLMJ2Eh6LdF3+/hoXz6+EFxV1mniA2L6il2fQL2AvQrHCuQn+QH dwm3ofmCWL9opXiaw87m6I4XGcfyAfsiqp3TsiqqD4zC2o8ubXvWkgg50KsuUdRVQm01 uq1DkZCtQgk83ww8WM3OYLbyC+qoZk1gYiEEyPIN3HyA7ywWbbMost1S7VltGWR3mngz PuKQ==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCXmTCTu0i04CHGaL2puyGg+3TuiPD98fRmT8MsMQFaHjebCxLdXImRvKIdYhXb+u5W7B8xYDg==@ietf.org
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwgchWrUcXXDLqf+XwyaL+42/dyL47ja16s5v7dTmGcB7sL3ttl B5NwRl2PdrBQmkMyvL95UgQoGjycup7jRWhlY8sFxEsTF6BWza7YLYztBvP4yD9jC1/yCSmEneS Sh4Q=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFkJmhqBRFXCufSz81TklSoErW/1nAoF1uQuWC4fIFCLSJ2jXCY1kDkeffM55v570JdHZs52g==
X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:3811:b0:2c9:887e:46de with SMTP id 98e67ed59e1d1-2d3aaa8899dmr2317197a91.12.1723629107633; Wed, 14 Aug 2024 02:51:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pg1-f170.google.com (mail-pg1-f170.google.com. [209.85.215.170]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 98e67ed59e1d1-2d3ac8311adsm1215569a91.56.2024.08.14.02.51.47 for <v6ops@ietf.org> (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 14 Aug 2024 02:51:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pg1-f170.google.com with SMTP id 41be03b00d2f7-7bb75419123so4378802a12.3 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 14 Aug 2024 02:51:47 -0700 (PDT)
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCU/w2YM++Xf+2XakTT91YPv9X/Cdvn7EiqRuuyXeoxGwDIRujIfYX2XoCTcLBZXGwVxqVUyxg==@ietf.org
X-Received: by 2002:a05:6a20:cf90:b0:1c6:a66e:1dea with SMTP id adf61e73a8af0-1c8eaed61e6mr2785908637.32.1723629106813; Wed, 14 Aug 2024 02:51:46 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <d16406c6-e5d9-4aa4-a16e-7513d04d6b07@gmail.com> <DB9PR07MB777164E663505AA86537EB1DD6852@DB9PR07MB7771.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com> <20240812142831.22a4f28e@zbook> <DB9PR07MB7771D93917C01A028E30FDEED6852@DB9PR07MB7771.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com> <0d0f35a3-1493-4e4e-8b4a-08f41fac2b2c@gmail.com> <CACyFTPFPRrW5MxZ8yoNPKYWxzaGQO-HnMNpEKR3TCbVpK6hgWg@mail.gmail.com> <20240813065439.061ef59a@zbook> <CACyFTPH+dA9xkCUT98zHr7AYpGyYFuOgOaynhsPjz3iKEuseog@mail.gmail.com> <20240813171637.48ce7cfe@zbook> <CACyFTPGgJsjLtoTegqy34BCSVH+vp_oxbKvBj3vnLaXpiD-vGA@mail.gmail.com> <Zrx7N9IWGeDqIuPf@Space.Net>
In-Reply-To: <Zrx7N9IWGeDqIuPf@Space.Net>
From: Daryll Swer <contact@daryllswer.com>
Date: Wed, 14 Aug 2024 15:21:12 +0530
X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: <CACyFTPHNiyVJOu695sP+o6PBBeWmggRag-hvzZ6A1XH4LMgfLw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACyFTPHNiyVJOu695sP+o6PBBeWmggRag-hvzZ6A1XH4LMgfLw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Gert Doering <gert@space.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000a2ec29061fa1aca8"
Message-ID-Hash: QAWHJ4V664Z3RGLG4O4BEV4EUJWKNYS6
X-Message-ID-Hash: QAWHJ4V664Z3RGLG4O4BEV4EUJWKNYS6
X-MailFrom: contact@daryllswer.com
X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-v6ops.ietf.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header
CC: "v6ops@ietf.org" <v6ops@ietf.org>
X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.9rc4
Precedence: list
Subject: [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/w4iGJF-rOZEVStHZhBpEKfpJu3M>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/v6ops>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Owner: <mailto:v6ops-owner@ietf.org>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Subscribe: <mailto:v6ops-join@ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <mailto:v6ops-leave@ietf.org>
Gert Doering There some good arguments for dynamic prefixes > No there isn't. people should stop putting explicit IPv6 addresses into places (which will > inevitably cause headaches when changing ISP) NPTv6 to the rescue for non-renumbering across static ISP PDs that changes when ISP *itself* is changed (rather than prefix within the same ISP). I'm pretty confident people do not change ISPs per 6 hours or per 24 hours etc, as is the case with the lease time on the dynamic prefixes to begin with. So actually having better support for automatic DNS registration/discovery > (mDNS and friends) and just making SoHo networks renumber automatically and > properly is a worthwile goal. Not sure what you mean, mDNS and friends, does not care about changing GUA or ULA prefixes, it operates on link-local addressing and does not work inter-VLAN anyway (without hacking using mDNS Repeaters/Proxies because link-local) — maybe I missed something here? I do agree that those 0.001% of people that SSH into their home > servers will hate SSHs dying on a renumbering event Are you a gamer, Gert? Because many end-users are (myself included), and if the games they play use IPv6 and works P2P native (we intend to have IPv6 for every layer 7 application, I hope), RIP (literally) to the player, when the genius ISPs flip the prefix on a live-session — same impact as the SSH example. Do we really need to create a list of everyday applications (beyond the so called 0.001% SSH users) that'd be impacted by dynamic/ever-changing 24/7 prefixes? I'm sure you got the point. *--* Best Regards Daryll Swer Website: daryllswer.com <https://mailtrack.io/l/1d97355348dc893a058a124bc232dfb55180bb39?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.daryllswer.com&u=2153471&signature=4f6124d3e9c0f630> On Wed, 14 Aug 2024 at 15:09, Gert Doering <gert@space.net> wrote: > Hi, > > On Wed, Aug 14, 2024 at 04:11:27AM +0530, Daryll Swer wrote: > > I'm not sure what you're proposing, Marco. But my stance on the matter is > > simple: Get rid of dynamic prefixes in IPv6 production. > > There some good arguments for dynamic prefixes, namely, people should stop > putting explicit IPv6 addresses into places (which will inevitably cause > headaches when changing ISP). So actually having better support for > automatic DNS registration/discovery (mDNS and friends) and just making > SoHo networks renumber automatically and properly is a worthwile goal. > > I do agree that those 0.001% of people that SSH into their home servers > will hate SSHs dying on a renumbering event... > > Gert Doering > -- NetMaster > -- > have you enabled IPv6 on something today...? > > SpaceNet AG Vorstand: Sebastian v. Bomhard, Ingo > Lalla, > Karin Schuler, Sebastian Cler > Joseph-Dollinger-Bogen 14 Aufsichtsratsvors.: A. Grundner-Culemann > D-80807 Muenchen HRB: 136055 (AG Muenchen) > Tel: +49 (0)89/32356-444 USt-IdNr.: DE813185279 >
- [v6ops] Re: v6ops Digest, Vol 168, Issue 29 The Multach's
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Jatin
- [v6ops] Re: v6ops Digest, Vol 168, Issue 29 Timothy Winters
- [v6ops] Re: v6ops Digest, Vol 168, Issue 29 The Multach's
- [v6ops] Re: v6ops Digest, Vol 168, Issue 29 Timothy Winters
- [v6ops] Re: v6ops Digest, Vol 168, Issue 29 Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: v6ops Digest, Vol 168, Issue 29 Ted Lemon
- [v6ops] Dynamic addresses Brian E Carpenter
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Brian E Carpenter
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses The Multach's
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Ted Lemon
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Marco Moock
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Ted Lemon
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Ted Lemon
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Gert Doering
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses David Farmer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses David Farmer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Brian E Carpenter
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Brian Candler
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Brian Candler
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses David Farmer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Tim Chown
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Gert Doering
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Gert Doering
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Erik Auerswald
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses George Michaelson
- [v6ops] Re: v6ops Digest, Vol 168, Issue 29 Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses N.Leymann
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Marco Moock
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Brian E Carpenter
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Marco Moock
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Marco Moock
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Tim Chown
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Gert Doering
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses David Farmer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Marco Moock
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses David Farmer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses N.Leymann
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Gert Doering
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Brian E Carpenter
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Daryll Swer
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses Ted Lemon
- [v6ops] Re: Dynamic addresses David Farmer