Re: [core] Retransmission of non-confirmable response message upon receiving request message retranmission?

Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org> Fri, 29 November 2019 13:55 UTC

Return-Path: <cabo@tzi.org>
X-Original-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: core@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4F73120802 for <core@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 29 Nov 2019 05:55:43 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.2
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yDYlyMn_Wyrt for <core@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 29 Nov 2019 05:55:41 -0800 (PST)
Received: from gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.50.17]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 51C4D120220 for <core@ietf.org>; Fri, 29 Nov 2019 05:55:41 -0800 (PST)
Received: from client-0117.vpn.uni-bremen.de (client-0117.vpn.uni-bremen.de [134.102.107.117]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by gabriel-vm-2.zfn.uni-bremen.de (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 47Pbcq48TJzyPJ; Fri, 29 Nov 2019 14:55:39 +0100 (CET)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.5 \(3445.9.1\))
From: Carsten Bormann <cabo@tzi.org>
In-Reply-To: <ce36c544626d41c8bdca5c727f57521b@bosch-si.com>
Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2019 14:55:39 +0100
Cc: Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg=40ericsson.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, "core@ietf.org" <core@ietf.org>
X-Mao-Original-Outgoing-Id: 596728537.0878201-1306146de4999a3caf6421d6611de75b
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-Id: <E8E3B244-A6D2-4575-B5A8-7A0685F1BB53@tzi.org>
References: <41889A1F-ACC3-458B-B57F-503A55D1D2A3@ericsson.com> <FB10E1B0-E52C-47F7-A0D9-87AE305E29F5@tzi.org> <09a7f0f318dc4f45a3cdd7791b28ecdd@bosch-si.com> <920091F4-EEA4-4407-AEBD-BE1C37DF199C@tzi.org> <ce36c544626d41c8bdca5c727f57521b@bosch-si.com>
To: "Kraus Achim (INST/ECS4)" <Achim.Kraus@bosch-si.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.9.1)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/core/4AZ9VYOrVVZke9pMX3CJ1R2hci4>
Subject: Re: [core] Retransmission of non-confirmable response message upon receiving request message retranmission?
X-BeenThere: core@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Constrained RESTful Environments \(CoRE\) Working Group list" <core.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/core>, <mailto:core-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/core/>
List-Post: <mailto:core@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:core-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/core>, <mailto:core-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2019 13:55:44 -0000

On Nov 29, 2019, at 14:34, Kraus Achim (INST/ECS4) <Achim.Kraus@bosch-si.com> wrote:
> 
> Hi Carsten,
> 
>> It does not mean the separate response is automatically retransmitted (that has its own ACK cycle).
> 
> though you're the author, I'm sure you know the intention :-).
> 
> Only resending the ACK, may keep the exchange open on the client side.
> I'm wondering, in which use-case this would be preferred over resending the flight, 
> which completes the exchange on the client side. 
> I hope my interpretation, that the decision is left to the implementation, is right? 

Well, yes, but you also need to consider congestion control.  
So I would not be too liberal about sending duplicate messages for the response side (at least I would make sure that the early resend counts against the outstanding retransmissions and triggers the exponential backoff in the same way as a retransmission — the sender should, of course, also go into exponential backoff, so this will be mostly OK then).
If there is an RTT estimate (CoCoA/Fasor), I’d also not send a duplicate if the RTT (RTO actually) has not elapsed since the last message was sent; the original message still has a good chance to arrive then.

Grüße, Carsten