Re: [dhcwg] Ben Campbell's Discuss on draft-ietf-dhc-relay-port-08: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)

Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com> Thu, 30 November 2017 02:24 UTC

Return-Path: <ben@nostrum.com>
X-Original-To: dhcwg@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dhcwg@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C45F812896F; Wed, 29 Nov 2017 18:24:18 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.879
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.879 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, T_SPF_HELO_PERMERROR=0.01, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6s7sZH9GShFN; Wed, 29 Nov 2017 18:24:17 -0800 (PST)
Received: from nostrum.com (raven-v6.nostrum.com [IPv6:2001:470:d:1130::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A18251287A3; Wed, 29 Nov 2017 18:24:17 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [10.0.1.92] (cpe-66-25-7-22.tx.res.rr.com [66.25.7.22]) (authenticated bits=0) by nostrum.com (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTPSA id vAU2OELB073358 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO); Wed, 29 Nov 2017 20:24:15 -0600 (CST) (envelope-from ben@nostrum.com)
X-Authentication-Warning: raven.nostrum.com: Host cpe-66-25-7-22.tx.res.rr.com [66.25.7.22] claimed to be [10.0.1.92]
From: Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com>
Message-Id: <1224A145-ADB8-4760-BBC7-9787CC3CBB2C@nostrum.com>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_27F834C2-E8D0-4209-B523-D5C155F0EFB1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg="pgp-sha512"
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.1 \(3445.4.7\))
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2017 20:24:13 -0600
In-Reply-To: <1F317916-E0C1-4EF5-A9C8-448FF02D3525@fugue.com>
Cc: The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, draft-ietf-dhc-relay-port@ietf.org, dhcwg@ietf.org, dhc-chairs@ietf.org
To: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>
References: <151198969282.31355.16877065112899804068.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <200CE2CC-D6D1-40BA-843A-1193DFFDEE74@fugue.com> <4364B55F-0BC5-42B9-965D-FEF9D9AED9C5@nostrum.com> <1F317916-E0C1-4EF5-A9C8-448FF02D3525@fugue.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.4.7)
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dhcwg/f49yJS8AOMMLe2ASF6FZqSrJH7w>
Subject: Re: [dhcwg] Ben Campbell's Discuss on draft-ietf-dhc-relay-port-08: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
X-BeenThere: dhcwg@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: <dhcwg.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dhcwg>, <mailto:dhcwg-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dhcwg/>
List-Post: <mailto:dhcwg@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dhcwg-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dhcwg>, <mailto:dhcwg-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2017 02:24:19 -0000

First, as I said in my discuss point, I planned to clear after a round of discussion. I think the discussion is on the right track, so I will clear.

More inline:

> On Nov 29, 2017, at 6:41 PM, Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com> wrote:
> 
> On Nov 29, 2017, at 7:15 PM, Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com> wrote:
>> Otherwise, if this is only intended for a specific context, it would help to have some language in the draft describing that scope. As written, I don’t see why a reader that was not involved in the creation of the draft would not assume it to be general purpose.
> 
> Suppose they did.   What would go wrong?

I thought you were using the idea that this was not general purpose as an argument about why we don’t need to worry about people trying to mix relays that implement this with other elements that do not :-)

> 
>> I’m almost convinced by the “same administrative domain” (although I think my “customer owned” cable modem has a relay, and it’s sort of fuzzy who’s administrative it belongs to :-) ). I think it would help to strengthen the language in 5.4 to make it clear what will break if people get this wrong.
> 
> Why would the owner or operator of the cable modem configure it to use a different DHCP port?

Sorry, the cable modem comment was merely an aside, not a material part of my argument. I recognize there’s no real reason for it to use this extension.

> 
> That said, I agree that this shouldn't be stated as updates to documents it's not updating.   This is an extension, not an update.   So sections 3.1 and 3.2 should really be stated as additional behavior for conforming implementations, not as updates to the base documents.
> 

Thanks!

Ben.