Re: [Manet-dt] Routing loops in proactive protocols, including OLSR

"Ian Chakeres" <ian.chakeres@gmail.com> Fri, 20 April 2007 12:25 UTC

Return-path: <manet-dt-bounces@ietf.org>
Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HesBa-0003jo-2A; Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:25:58 -0400
Received: from manet-dt by megatron.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1HesBY-0003jY-TO for manet-dt-confirm+ok@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:25:56 -0400
Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HesBY-0003jN-J7 for manet-dt@ietf.org; Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:25:56 -0400
Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com ([66.249.82.235]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1HesBY-0006NL-08 for manet-dt@ietf.org; Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:25:56 -0400
Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id h31so1002185wxd for <manet-dt@ietf.org>; Fri, 20 Apr 2007 05:25:55 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=n/5ZKr0y/6yHECIcVOHAa0yKk7BoFVbdMTDzk+oGc4gPK4Aipdo5vNOfzfiWGSDsda64yFNG/2Yfqbppwco+scznr1cFAT4JIBpdn+3hdaav7sieZ9bb/ZQYnsP0yvjfBkVsG2iva9kDKhuwrOHfrC+uWMPwncmzkGCh0MtnM1g=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=noZpaW7ESZMqmJBDt5T9MOCRjuABq8clp9EtQYtp3GqWs32kCBu9Vd0/4Xh5MfuVTWZnd3pXuUJQzbDbjd+1IYxcj7oSAO6klaffV+e7iZLzTyfkjvllXxDgxO/FZe8StkS8IiQYiiUKyhJctnPq/eQk2imsgcKHS5Qw9tYfWFw=
Received: by 10.78.170.17 with SMTP id s17mr474190hue.1177071950907; Fri, 20 Apr 2007 05:25:50 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.78.45.10 with HTTP; Fri, 20 Apr 2007 05:25:50 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <374005f30704200525u7dbdf61due17dccffd0642310@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 17:55:50 +0530
From: Ian Chakeres <ian.chakeres@gmail.com>
To: Teco Boot <teco@inf-net.nl>
Subject: Re: [Manet-dt] Routing loops in proactive protocols, including OLSR
In-Reply-To: <002d01c77dc3$0ec5b080$0202a8c0@Teco>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline
References: <Acd9wwpKzNXpAco1S4G9TC2ybci62Q==> <002d01c77dc3$0ec5b080$0202a8c0@Teco>
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Scan-Signature: bdc523f9a54890b8a30dd6fd53d5d024
Cc: manet-dt@ietf.org
X-BeenThere: manet-dt@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5
Precedence: list
List-Id: MANET Design Team <manet-dt.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet-dt>, <mailto:manet-dt-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www1.ietf.org/pipermail/manet-dt>
List-Post: <mailto:manet-dt@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:manet-dt-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet-dt>, <mailto:manet-dt-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: manet-dt-bounces@ietf.org

I think this is a good recommendation. I would not have a problem
saying DYMO nodes MAY/SHOULD run DPD on unicast packets.

Ian

On 4/13/07, Teco Boot <teco@inf-net.nl> wrote:
> Once more on routing loops. I suggested DPD for unicast, for reducing impact
> of a routing loop. I didn't receive any response on it. Perhaps the problem
> is not known or impact is not fully understood. Please react on this problem
> and suggest next steps.
>
> Loops in unicast routing takes place when interface state changes. When an
> interface goes down, the routing table is adjusted quickly for removing
> entries with a next hop via this interface. Alternative routes could be used
> quickly also. Other router routing tables are updated after routing protocol
> activity; this could take milliseconds up to minutes, depending on protocol
> and timer settings. During this convergence, routing loops can occur and
> packet starvation is handled by TTL mechanism.
>
> On wireless media, using TTL for starvation could have a high impact on
> radio resources and spectrum utilization, and IMHO the behavior is
> unacceptable. For this reason I suggested using DPD for unicast also.
>
> Scenario with a routing loop problem in MANET topology:
>
> +----+        +----+        +----+
> | R1 |--------| R2 |--------| R3 |
> +----+        +----+        +----+
>    |                          |
>    |    =+=+= obstacle =+=+   |
>    |                          |
> +----+                      +----+
> | R4 |----------------------| R5 |  R5 moves this way --->
> +----+                      +----+
>
> I assume a hop-count based metric (although I reject this approach due to
> the WPF syndrome problem) and I focus on the link between R1 and R4, for
> traffic from R4 to R5. R4 selects R5 as next-hop. Now the link between R4
> and R5 breaks:
>
> +----+        +----+        +----+
> | R1 |--------| R2 |--------| R3 |
> +----+        +----+        +----+
>    |                           \
>    |    =+=+= obstacle =+=+     \
>    |                             \
> +----+                         +----+
> | R4 |                         | R5 |  R5 moves this way --->
> +----+                         +----+
>
> R4 and R5 detect the change due to the hello mechanism or L2 triggers. After
> R4 is aware of the failure, it immediately adjusts its routing table. It
> uses R1 as next hop for traffic to R5. However, R1 is still not aware of the
> topology change and uses R4 as next hop for traffic towards R5. Now the
> routing loop occurs:
>
>      +----+        +----+        +----+
>      | R1 |--------| R2 |--------| R3 |
>      +----+        +----+        +----+
>       ^ |                           \
> Loop: | |    =+=+= obstacle =+=+     \
>       | v                             \
>      +----+                          +----+
>      | R4 |                          | R5 |  R5 moved
>      +----+                          +----+
>
> The loop is solved as soon as R1 is aware of the new topology. Delay is
> caused by routing protocol packet transfer, timers and processing time.
> Protocol timers that slow down packet transfer or introduce jitter in SPF
> calculation increase loop duration. So jitter introduced by
> draft-clausen-manet-jitter emphasizes the routing loop problem.
>
> Teco
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Manet-dt mailing list
> Manet-dt@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet-dt
>


_______________________________________________
Manet-dt mailing list
Manet-dt@ietf.org
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/manet-dt