Re: [rfc-i] Fwd: Re: [xml2rfc] Change in the results of using the "author" tag

On 12-Apr-19 20:50, Martin J. Dürst wrote:
> Hello Brian,
> 
> On 2019/04/12 10:35, Brian E Carpenter wrote:
>> Hi Charlie,
>>
>> Sad to say I think you are wrong. Every journal I've ever submitted
>> to has its own required style for citations,
> 
> Agree; I already said so much in another mail just recently.
> 
>> and I'd say that overall
>> styles that require or permit given names rather than initials are unusual.
>> So the RFC Series is using a fairly standard practice.
> 
> This is true too, but it puts people with names such as "Francisca Yu" 
> or "John Smith", and Chinese, Koreans, and Danes in general, at a 
> disadvantage.

Fortunately for me, none of the other Brian Carpenters has showed up at the IETF yet, not even https://hackerone.com/geeknik. But nobody is immune to this problem. I'm not unsympathetic to Charlie's underlying issue.

   Brian

> 
> Regards,   Martin.
> 
>> For the IEEE's own style, see
>> https://ieee-dataport.org/sites/default/files/analysis/27/IEEE%20Citation%20Guidelines.pdf
>>
>> This page is quite informative:
>> https://pitt.libguides.com/citationhelp
>>
>> Or this, for the ACM style:
>> http://www.citethisforme.com/guides/association-for-computing-machinery
>>
>> Regards
>>     Brian Carpenter
>>
>> On 10-Apr-19 05:30, Charlie Perkins wrote:
>>> Hello Heather and all,
>>>
>>> I was redirected to ask you instead of xml2rfc...
>>>
>>> Basically, I think it is wrong to enforce RFC Style Guide limitations when showing the authorship of external documents.  So, for instance, if an external publication shows that the author is "Francisca Yu", I don't think we should require the initialized version in the citation of an IETF document.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Charlie P.
>>>
>>> PS. No offense to Ms. Yu.
>>>
>>> PPS. Can someone tell me how to cite a stable URL?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>>> Subject: 	Re: [xml2rfc] Change in the results of using the "author" tag
>>> Date: 	Tue, 9 Apr 2019 19:10:37 +0200
>>> From: 	Julian Reschke <julian.reschke@gmx.de>
>>> To: 	Charlie Perkins <charles.perkins@earthlink.net>
>>> CC: 	xml2rfc@ietf.org
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 09.04.2019 18:43, Charlie Perkins wrote:
>>>> Hello Julian,
>>>>
>>>> I followed your suggestion.  Now it shows that the author is "D. Stanley".
>>>>
>>>> The actual document shows that the author is "Dorothy Stanley".
>>>>
>>>> Regardless of what the IETF says about handling names for RFCs, I think
>>>> that external citations should reflect the authorship as indicated in
>>>> the external publication.
>>>
>>> Well, that contradicts the RFC Style Guide.
>>>
>>>> I also tried simply deleting 'initials="D" surname="Stanley"' from the
>>>> citation.  xml2rfc imposes the requirement anyway.
>>>>
>>>> Can we please have it to respect the actual authorship as shown in the
>>>> publications which we cite?
>>>
>>> That's a discussion you need to lead with the RFC Editor, not the tools
>>> implementers.
>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Charlie P.

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