Re: [Smart] Epistemology in the Cloud

Kirsty P <Kirsty.p@ncsc.gov.uk> Mon, 17 December 2018 17:50 UTC

Return-Path: <Kirsty.p@ncsc.gov.uk>
X-Original-To: smart@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: smart@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C36F2130EEB for <smart@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 17 Dec 2018 09:50:06 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.471
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.471 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-1.46, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTTPS_HTTP_MISMATCH=1.989, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ncsc.gov.uk
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id b20CzqqWgqTb for <smart@ietfa.amsl.com>; Mon, 17 Dec 2018 09:50:03 -0800 (PST)
Received: from GBR01-LO2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-eopbgr100136.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.10.136]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C7281130EE9 for <smart@irtf.org>; Mon, 17 Dec 2018 09:50:02 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ncsc.gov.uk; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=TIeeNEKLzokBu+AXoFkT+D6fuTwBUZtVUh/x73j7qt8=; b=H2LZtYJ65XVReusJae4tQ5YTbWi0rD2QwvrbuWkiqnqH6qSk9jZwiIAMNrvzjLw6mCEQJHE8oNo+4GHR+lZZFM1UHH+/ZBirpLJtihLWqu7z7gig6XStMBib6nZnQfmlz64L23PM9ZvEZ12zTasmkInm2NBTu3Rv5bPWfWNWdXw=
Received: from MMXP123MB0847.GBRP123.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.166.238.153) by MMXP123MB0768.GBRP123.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (10.166.237.135) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.1425.20; Mon, 17 Dec 2018 17:49:59 +0000
Received: from MMXP123MB0847.GBRP123.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([fe80::c022:568a:ecf5:a188]) by MMXP123MB0847.GBRP123.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([fe80::c022:568a:ecf5:a188%5]) with mapi id 15.20.1425.021; Mon, 17 Dec 2018 17:49:59 +0000
From: Kirsty P <Kirsty.p@ncsc.gov.uk>
To: Henry Story <henry.story@co-operating.systems>
CC: "smart@irtf.org" <smart@irtf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Smart] Epistemology in the Cloud
Thread-Index: AQHUk7GlueRUfpUdI0OGv+rnb+9E/KV+RnCh
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2018 17:49:59 +0000
Message-ID: <LO1P123MB08368C330C36927CEE4C7682D7A10@LO1P123MB0836.GBRP123.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM>
References: <7F20A91C-B493-4955-9547-552BE718A29D@co-operating.systems>
In-Reply-To: <7F20A91C-B493-4955-9547-552BE718A29D@co-operating.systems>
Accept-Language: en-GB, en-US
Content-Language: en-GB
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=Kirsty.p@ncsc.gov.uk;
x-originating-ip: [51.141.34.27]
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; MMXP123MB0768; 6:p6LRdjFWXtSqrLvbD4K2HXeA2wxwamhYMfJZOAfVGnfZ97lOTpdy0jDbic/kLrLZVmcusFbEF6PFDA3ETTgUoa37UIaIeywUSj7xk0akNj+/9C8s+vs4p+mknE+ajc4VVSqMcID/T/uSww69zuL/RyXb5ogpkUOjOMYHNbj1zKe9r/4z/A7Yxn2daj7sX+1MYiGThZdWfAOslT6LpXui2pus4eeh+4TF+8Zr/Xrf8E0xxxSCm24Iby3BH84v5N9jNdP9yXHE8KHow5oAmmmQx0ANyT86B/gt5zNgTEU0zrbpYuobWQAKpjrcX8F4sFAfLD3WKo4B3PF1fEcJqSHCT7iIAgXJyimqqI/hooWccU7Dd3VGYXZMHNOwTFncVxUxpU+q6M/s59ysANWNVhR8WdL1mKGe0loJeJKQQXKi3anCPwXvnryd+q3jHkBnAtX51V8KhauMNt1HOnYWBav2Eg==; 5:ypnIjxOQTXcZF+tz/JzufHwY7TOnH7vYTda1c29QzV249e+gHFTiFMLrjgVYhvHZFVjXatz0LW6FNBTTeAyTW5NnQ3v0RSfjFippEsfRIsO7SVHIrb35IGbxrxe3u17JO3GogTVtlSkM5D/n9x1qau7rj9nM9Ctiz1wm5wP+Z8E=; 7:H21eEw4kFdFyMie2h+BJDalYkDq5KSqyNBxO6+zpo/tWkJYAU8N0AINZBBLDLhaSBv16ITeQDE2LrS8aZpP/jxqkOsjJdHj4lf58cnmun0T97QSyxmFvxMM8LNPTDf6qBS0w369CZTHYEOZ+4Uf9Rw==
x-ms-exchange-antispam-srfa-diagnostics: SOS;
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 09fb27ad-4ffa-4163-e920-08d664481095
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(4534185)(7168020)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(5600074)(711020)(2017052603328)(7153060)(7193020); SRVR:MMXP123MB0768;
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MMXP123MB0768:
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <MMXP123MB076894FD35523EB8AA7E7281D7BC0@MMXP123MB0768.GBRP123.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM>
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(8211001083)(3230021)(999002)(5005020)(6040522)(2401047)(8121501046)(93006095)(93001095)(3231475)(944501520)(52105112)(3002001)(10201501046)(148016)(149066)(150057)(6041310)(20161123558120)(20161123562045)(20161123560045)(201703131423095)(201702281528075)(20161123555045)(201703061421075)(201703061406153)(20161123564045)(201708071742011)(7699051)(76991095); SRVR:MMXP123MB0768; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:MMXP123MB0768;
x-forefront-prvs: 08897B549D
x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(39850400004)(346002)(376002)(396003)(366004)(136003)(189003)(199004)(99286004)(86362001)(71200400001)(7736002)(476003)(6512007)(9686003)(71190400001)(105586002)(106356001)(6436002)(2906002)(72206003)(575784001)(486006)(45080400002)(54896002)(6306002)(25786009)(966005)(446003)(1015004)(478600001)(236005)(6486002)(14454004)(256004)(81166006)(6916009)(6606003)(102836004)(6506007)(53546011)(55236004)(6246003)(26005)(229853002)(53936002)(66574012)(14444005)(33656002)(11346002)(6116002)(68736007)(316002)(3846002)(606006)(8676002)(76176011)(19627405001)(186003)(5660300001)(74482002)(74316002)(97736004)(81156014)(4326008)(66066001)(8936002)(75922002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:MMXP123MB0768; H:MMXP123MB0847.GBRP123.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1;
received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ncsc.gov.uk does not designate permitted sender hosts)
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: JY0AKMO9qPy4qSL1O2BuELrg1qjY5S8VLNGP/Xs3cYI5QfRcTIK4N35NStxXLDW57k/Fdpzg9klj+L9DwDIlZUE7cGvHwN1puBqJSwz6H7YNOVzOrJQiNq6LIOcCX7E3rcCryNvzqSpMEdVZS5M2ExVOMRkCSONDQRR3CYT0rD0oPX5qfStyeBWN3dbfxOykEJxHHEc8hqVJyUF7uzvG50nQUu1OQ5f7iMhu/daGpglXumwV6nlYATPSUojIloTt4wgJ6N5vQFBmvyqVI51Og7zqvf095o73JuEHyTd6akfwqk24H31YsQZXEBKY/yWs
spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99
spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_LO1P123MB08368C330C36927CEE4C7682D7A10LO1P123MB0836GBRP_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: ncsc.gov.uk
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 09fb27ad-4ffa-4163-e920-08d664481095
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 17 Dec 2018 17:49:59.6285 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 14aa5744-ece1-474e-a2d7-34f46dda64a1
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: MMXP123MB0768
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/smart/4CSpGFDG95kG4Tjr28QnucHwXhc>
Subject: Re: [Smart] Epistemology in the Cloud
X-BeenThere: smart@irtf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: Stopping Malware And Researching Threats <smart.irtf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/options/smart>, <mailto:smart-request@irtf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/smart/>
List-Post: <mailto:smart@irtf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:smart-request@irtf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/smart>, <mailto:smart-request@irtf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2018 17:50:07 -0000

Hi Henry,


Thanks for your interest in the group! I can see that you discussed phishing on the SAAG list in July - perhaps an example of many people having the same good idea at the same time! I actually had the idea for SMART a bit earlier, with the ambition that SMART will span more than only phishing - to defend against the breadth of attacks that we see on the Internet today. If you have specific research on phishing that you would like to bring into SMART, we would be very interested to see it, especially as significantly reducing UK-hosted phishing has been one of NCSC's key achievements since we started.<https://www.ncsc.gov.uk/news/annual-review-2018>


Your linked research looks interesting; however I suggest it might be a better fit for the HRPC RG. In fact, I think "Fake News" was brought up in the last IETF as a possible future work topic!


Kirsty



________________________________
From: Smart <smart-bounces@irtf.org> on behalf of Henry Story <henry.story@co-operating.systems>
Sent: 14 December 2018 13:33:30
To: smart@irtf.org
Subject: [Smart] Epistemology in the Cloud

Hi folks,

        this group was started following a thread I started on IETF
SAAG mailing list this summer. I had to write up my second year PhD
report, and move apartments in the mean time, so I have not yet been
able to follow the activity here, but will have time now.

My paper was published at the International Semantic Web conference
and I put it online here:

  https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmedium.com%2F%40bblfish%2Fepistemology-in-the-cloud-472fad4c8282&amp;data=02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cb8f1af6d83a14a59f7ad08d661c8c5aa%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C636803912285466919&amp;sdata=iN5BTpiUrD%2FTFyOZShwANcNPH0rEnvLm2H1dlBqWaUc%3D&amp;reserved=0

with a number of follow up blog posts.

I would be happy to try to adapt this paper to get it published
somewhere that could start a discussion with people involved in
thinking about security issues - I am trying to make semantic web
and security folks meet, which is about as difficult as getting
hippies to work with army folks. :-) If you have ideas what would be
the best place to do that I'd be happy to try. And of course I'd
be happy to know that questions this paper raises in this community
so that I can try to address them.


Sincerely,

  Henry Story
  https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fco-operating.systems%2F&amp;data=02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cb8f1af6d83a14a59f7ad08d661c8c5aa%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C636803912285466919&amp;sdata=2KIcrdke%2BDSigWq%2Fn754ultFa2VXUMpZFBEs1TqWc0A%3D&amp;reserved=0

--
Smart mailing list
Smart@irtf.org
https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irtf.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Fsmart&amp;data=02%7C01%7Ckirsty.p%40ncsc.gov.uk%7Cb8f1af6d83a14a59f7ad08d661c8c5aa%7C14aa5744ece1474ea2d734f46dda64a1%7C0%7C0%7C636803912285466919&amp;sdata=1JyxOFlO47rpe4qWQlkeAsHWagFr899PbbbBs3PKh10%3D&amp;reserved=0
This information is exempt under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 (FOIA) and may be exempt under other UK information legislation. Refer any FOIA queries to ncscinfoleg@ncsc.gov.uk