Re: [addr-select-dt] RFC 3484 issues in address selection in the presence of an IPv4 NAT

Arifumi Matsumoto <arifumi@nttv6.net> Mon, 23 March 2009 23:28 UTC

Return-Path: <arifumi@nttv6.net>
X-Original-To: addr-select-dt@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: addr-select-dt@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2CB128C1A9 for <addr-select-dt@core3.amsl.com>; Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:28:57 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.239
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.239 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.240, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_13=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rpXMtY-nT2nL for <addr-select-dt@core3.amsl.com>; Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:28:57 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail.nttv6.net (mail.nttv6.net [IPv6:2001:fa8::25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8ADE43A6C09 for <addr-select-dt@ietf.org>; Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:28:56 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [IPv6:::1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.nttv6.net (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id n2NNTan0098251; Tue, 24 Mar 2009 08:29:37 +0900 (JST) (envelope-from arifumi@nttv6.net)
Message-Id: <A198B6AE-7A31-432C-94ED-33EC7158F7B8@nttv6.net>
From: Arifumi Matsumoto <arifumi@nttv6.net>
To: Fred Baker <fred@cisco.com>
In-Reply-To: <AB501AE2-69A0-4B31-8860-ECD3CC095FDE@cisco.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"; format="flowed"; delsp="yes"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v930.3)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 08:29:36 +0900
References: <A28B6BD7-6BCF-4E1B-B0C0-2A3785B845B4@cisco.com> <695BF428-E196-4492-8FC7-51045BA2D89D@nokia.com> <AB501AE2-69A0-4B31-8860-ECD3CC095FDE@cisco.com>
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.930.3)
X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.0.1 (mail.nttv6.net [127.0.0.1]); Tue, 24 Mar 2009 08:29:39 +0900 (JST)
Cc: 6man Chairs <6man-chairs@tools.ietf.org>, 6man-ads@tools.ietf.org, bob.hinden@nokia.com, Ron Bonica <rbonica@juniper.net>, addr-select-dt@ietf.org, Kurt Erik Lindqvist <kurtis@kurtis.pp.se>, draft-denis-v6ops-nat-addrsel@tools.ietf.org
Subject: Re: [addr-select-dt] RFC 3484 issues in address selection in the presence of an IPv4 NAT
X-BeenThere: addr-select-dt@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: IPv6 Address Selection Design Team <addr-select-dt.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/addr-select-dt>, <mailto:addr-select-dt-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/addr-select-dt>
List-Post: <mailto:addr-select-dt@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:addr-select-dt-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/addr-select-dt>, <mailto:addr-select-dt-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 23:28:57 -0000

Fred and Robert,
thank you for shepherding.

Today's session made me feel that changing the existing *default*  
address selection behavior is too difficult, now that that behavior  
may be is utilized somewhere we don't know.

So, we definitely need customization mechanism of address selection  
policy in application-specific, host-specific, and site-specific way.

Best,

On 2009/03/24, at 6:52, Fred Baker wrote:

>
> On Mar 23, 2009, at 2:36 PM, Bob Hinden wrote:
>
>> Fred,
>>
>> We have a design team in this area.  I suspect they were in the the  
>> v6ops session this morning.  I copied them here.
>
> I'm pretty sure they were. I'm formally closing the loop here, which  
> I said I would do this morning.
>
>> Bob
>>
>>
>> On Mar 23, 2009, at 2:02 PM, ext Fred Baker wrote:
>>
>>> I'd like to bring
>>>
>>> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-denis-v6ops-nat-addrsel
>>> "Problems with IPv6 source address selection and IPv4 NATs", Remi
>>> Denis-Courmont, 18-Feb-09, <draft-denis-v6ops-nat-addrsel-00.txt>
>>>
>>> to your attention. We discussed it briefly this morning in v6ops.  
>>> The sense of the room was that it was likely related to your  
>>> effort to improve RFC 3484.
>>>
>>> Along those lines, the discussion at the mike included at least  
>>> two points that RFC 3484 runs afoul of. One is that RFC 3484  
>>> enables no API for administrative control, and administrators are  
>>> likely to want to update it in their environments. The other is  
>>> that the logic that addresses have degrees of likelihood of being  
>>> useful in a fixed order - any fixed order - is problematic.  
>>> Rather, one might have an initial order one uses, but as the  
>>> system gains experience of what address selections are most  
>>> useful, it would be better to have the OS, guided by the  
>>> application, try those addresses that have historically been  
>>> useful first.
>>>
>>> How would you recommend proceeding? Would you prefer to take this  
>>> draft into 6man and including it in the RFC 3484 update?
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> addr-select-dt mailing list
> addr-select-dt@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/addr-select-dt