Re: [alto] I-D Action: draft-ietf-alto-unified-props-new-09.txt

[Jensen Zhang <[e-mail]>]

Hi Kai,

Great! This structure looks better to clarify those concepts. I would like
to support it. If nobody has another proposal against it, let's add this
change in the next revision.

I can send a new draft to you by this weekend so that you can take another
pass before we upload the next revision.

Thanks,
Jensen


On Wed, Oct 9, 2019 at 10:46 PM Kai GAO <[e-mail]> wrote:

> Hi Jensen and all,
>
> Actually, I would suggest the following structure:
>
> - Basic Concepts
>   - Information Resource
>   - Entity
>   - Entity Property
>   - Entity Domain
> - Property Map  <====  Explain how property map works and the motivations
> for exporting and aggregating entity domains
>   - Resource-Specific Entity Domain
>   - Aggregated Entity Domain
>   - Resource-Specify Entity Property
>
> The two top-level sections (basic concepts and property map) are similar
> to Sec 2 (Terminology) and Sec 5 (Network Map) in RFC 7285.
>
> In the basic concepts section, we are describing what already exists even
> without the property map service.
>
> In the property map section, we are "inventing" concepts that serve
> certain practical purposes (e.g., provide indications of what
> entities/properties can be queried, aggregate entities/properties).
>
> Having said that, it is OK with me that we keep the current structure or
> only make some small changes if it requires too much work.
>
> Best,
> Kai
>
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 10, 2019 at 12:11 AM Jensen Zhang <[e-mail]>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi Kai,
>>
>> I reviewed the document again. I think you are proposing the following
>> restructure, right?
>>
>> Entity -> Information Resource -> Entity Property (Resource-Specific
>> Entity Property) -> Property Map -> Entity Domain (Resource-Specific Entity
>> Domain, Aggregated Entity Domain)
>>
>> Intuitively it looks good. But when you look into the motivation of
>> Resource-Specific Entity Property, you will find it is weak here. Because
>> only when you use the Aggregated Entity Domain representation in a Property
>> Map, you will need this concept. Otherwise, it is useless. That is why I
>> put it behind those two concepts. But maybe your intuition is right. The "
>> Resource-Specific Entity Property" should be out of "Entity Domain". How
>> about we move 2.5.4 to 2.6? How do you think?
>>
>> Best,
>> Jensen
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 9, 2019 at 9:02 AM Kai GAO <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Jensen and all,
>>>
>>> I'm looking at the -10 version and find it quite odd to have 2.5.4
>>> Resource-specific Entity Property as a subsection of 2.4 Entity Domain.
>>>
>>> My suggestion is to move 2.5.4 to 2.2 instead. Another potential
>>> improvement is to move 2.4 Information Resource before 2.2.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Kai
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Sep 27, 2019 at 5:28 AM Jensen Zhang <[e-mail]>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Danny,
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for your review and comments. Sabine and I are working on the
>>>> next revision. We will address all the issues in the next revision.
>>>>
>>>> And for your additional comment, actually, the "ip-pid-property-map"
>>>> resource in IRD is an example of Aggregated Entity Domain. Sec 9.7 should
>>>> illustrate it. But you are right, the current example in Sec 9.7 does not
>>>> show the benefit of Aggregated Entity Domain. I will also revise this
>>>> example in the next revision.
>>>>
>>>> Looking forward to your further comments.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>> Jensen
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Sep 25, 2019 at 9:50 AM Danny Alex Lachos Perez <
>>>> [e-mail]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Sabine,
>>>>>
>>>>> I have a quick additional comment:
>>>>>
>>>>> I believe that an example (sec. 9) of Aggregated Entity Domain is
>>>>> missing.
>>>>> Perhaps you could re-use (or extend) the IRD example [0] and try to
>>>>> add a couple of sentences to indicate equivalent entity property mappings
>>>>> (see slide 17, 18 in [1]).
>>>>>
>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Danny Lachos
>>>>> [0]
>>>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-alto-unified-props-new-09#page-28
>>>>> [1]
>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/105/materials/slides-105-alto-unified-properties-for-the-alto-protocol-02.pdf
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Sep 24, 2019 at 10:42 AM Randriamasy, Sabine (Nokia -
>>>>> FR/Paris-Saclay) <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Danny,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Many thanks for your review. I saw your last comment is in Section
>>>>>> 9.7.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Should we consider that until section 9.7 your review is complete or
>>>>>> will you have more questions?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We look forward to your other comments,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sabine
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *From:* alto <[e-mail]> *On Behalf Of *Danny Alex
>>>>>> Lachos Perez
>>>>>> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 17, 2019 8:28 PM
>>>>>> *To:* IETF ALTO <[e-mail]>
>>>>>> *Cc:* [e-mail]
>>>>>> *Subject:* Re: [alto] I-D Action:
>>>>>> draft-ietf-alto-unified-props-new-09...txt
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dear authors,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I started to read the “*Unified Properties for the ALTO Protocol*” draft
>>>>>> (-09).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please, see my first comments in the attached file (search for
>>>>>> '[DANNY]').
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Many of them are suggestions about clarity and format issues .
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I will continue the review and send additional comments in a short
>>>>>> time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Danny Lachos
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Sep 4, 2019 at 10:41 AM <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
>>>>>> directories.
>>>>>> This draft is a work item of the Application-Layer Traffic
>>>>>> Optimization WG of the IETF.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>         Title           : Unified Properties for the ALTO Protocol
>>>>>>         Authors         : Wendy Roome
>>>>>>                           Sabine Randriamasy
>>>>>>                           Y. Richard Yang
>>>>>>                           Jingxuan Jensen Zhang
>>>>>>                           Kai Gao
>>>>>>         Filename        : draft-ietf-alto-unified-props-new-09.txt
>>>>>>         Pages           : 43
>>>>>>         Date            : 2019-09-04
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Abstract:
>>>>>>    This document extends the Application-Layer Traffic Optimization
>>>>>>    (ALTO) Protocol [RFC7285] by generalizing the concept of "endpoint
>>>>>>    properties" to generic types of entities, and by presenting those
>>>>>>    properties as maps, similar to the network and cost maps in
>>>>>>    [RFC7285].
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
>>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-alto-unified-props-new/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There are also htmlized versions available at:
>>>>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-alto-unified-props-new-09
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-alto-unified-props-new-09
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A diff from the previous version is available at:
>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-alto-unified-props-new-09
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
>>>>>> submission
>>>>>> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
>>>>>> ftp://ftp...ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>>>>>> <ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/>
>>>>>>
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