Update: Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection
"Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk> Thu, 25 May 2006 16:47 UTC
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Reply-To: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
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Subject: Update: Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection
Date: Thu, 25 May 2006 17:35:32 +0100
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi, Jim Jones has been in touch to ask that we hold off responding for a while. it appears that having read this draft response, some OIF folk would like to spend some time clarifying the questions. Thanks, Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk> To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org> Sent: Monday, May 22, 2006 8:50 PM Subject: Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection > Hi, > > Thanks to those who have sent me off-list comments. > > Here is a draft response to the OIF on 1:n protection. Please send me (or > the list) your comments. > > Thanks, > Adrian > > === > Dear Jim, > > Thank you for your communication to CCAMP on the use of GMPLS to provide > 1:n protection at the OIF UNI and the OIF E-NNI. > > We are grateful for this opportunity to comment, but we note that this > type of communication requesting clarifications is better suited to a > mailing list discussion than to official communications that, by their > nature, have a slow turn-around. The appropriate place for > discussions of GMPLS protocols is the CCAMP working group > mailing list. Details of how to subscribe to the mailing list can be found > at http://www.ietf.org/html.charters/ccamp-charter.html > >> Future updates to OIF UNI and E-NNI signaling may include a feature >> for 1:N connection protection. The attached document presents >> requirements for these features. Recently a review was completed >> of RFCs 4426, 4427 and 4428 and IETF drafts that may be able to >> implement this function (including draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery- >> e2e-signaling-03 and draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-02). >> It appears that the abstract messages from RFC 4426 provide much >> of this functionality, however several questions resulted from this >> review. OIF would appreciate review and comments from IETF >>CCAMP on the following items. >> >> 1.) OIF would appreciate knowing if there are protocol features in >> other IETF documents relevant to 1:N protection . > > We would like to suggest that, in order to utilize advanced features of > the GMPLS control plane protocol, engineers should be familiar with > the full set of GMPLS RFCs and Internet-Drafts. These are listed on > the CCAMP charter page and can be downloaded free of charge by > clicking on the links. > > Although not all of this work is directly related to protection and > restoration, it should be noted that any protocol aspect present for a > working path may also be required for a protection path. Protocol > engineers must, therefore, be familiar with the details of the protocol > before attempting to provide advanced functions like protection. > >> 2.) RFC 4426 section 2.5.2 says "it MAY be possible for the LSPs >> on the working link to be mapped to the protection link without >> re-signaling each individual LSP" and "it MAY be possible to change >> the component links without needing to re-signal each individual LSP". >> OIF would like to know what signaling messages and objects can be >> used to accomplish this. > > Your question is confusing in the light of the referenced section. > The section describes the messages required to achieve span protection. > Clearly, if a span is protected, then all LSPs carried over that span > may be transparently protected. This is how normal link protection > operates and there is nothing clever going on. > > Recall that section 2.5.2 is a subsection of section 2, and this is > entirely dedicated to span protection. > > Further, if the bundling example is followed, the referenced RFC > (RFC4201) explains the signaling necessary to achieve bundling. > > You may find it easier to consider this as a layering architecture. The > span (link) that is protected is a lower layer commodity and its > protection may be, therefore, transparent to the higher layer. > > If you have a specific question we would be happy to answer. > >> 3.) It is suggested that the Failure Indication Message (or >> equivalent) from RFC 4426 can be triggered not only from a >> failure but also a command from a management system. > > You have not asked a specific question here so it is hard to give any > answer except for "yes". > > Management systems are usually regarded as supreme. A management > system can instruct an implementation to do anything, and this may be > useful for forced or controlled switch-over. You may want to refer to > RFC4427 section 4.13. > >> 4.) A goal of the 1:N protection is to use a bulk notification and >> recovery procedure, based on RFC 4427 section 4.15. However, that RFC >> states the corresponding recovery switching actions are performed at >> the LSP level. It would be useful to know if bulk processing could be >> applied to recovery of individual connection segments on the failed span, >> not entire LSPs. > > We do not understand your question. Each LSP has its own entry in the > switching matrix. Any switching recovery action that is required can > only be applied to this individual entry. Implementations may have some > optimisations (such as back-up, pre-programmed matrices, or magic matrix > re-program commands), but this is clearly out of scope of a control > plane specification. > > Please note that recovery switching actions are not signaling actions. > > We are also confused as to the meaning of "It would be useful to know if > bulk processing could be applied to recovery of individual connection > segments on the failed span, not entire LSPs." To process it further, we > probably need to deconstruct the term Connection Segment. As you may be > aware, the term 'connection segment' is not widely used in the ASON > Recommendations and does not find a definition there. The reference from > G.8081 is to an ATM forum document. > > We assume that you are concerned to provide end-to-end data transfer. > Presumably you are interested in a variety of symmetrical cases such as > client-layer connectivity, UNI-C to UNI-C connectivity, UNI-N to UNI-N > connectivity, or UNI-N/E-NNI to E-NNI/UNI-N connectivity. The path > between these points is an LSP (it may be a hierarchical LSP through which > other LSPs are tunneled) and it is this path that you wish to protect. > Whether you perform span, segment, or end-to-end protection, you are still > protecting the LSP. > >> 5.) RFC 4426 refers to three abstract messages involved in the >> reversion sequence: >> >> - A Bridge and Switch Request message from the source node after it >> has bridged traffic back to both working and protection links. >> >> - A Bridge and Switch Response message from the destination node after >> it has bridged traffic back to both working and protection links and >> changed its selector to the working link. >> >> - A Bridge and Switch Completed message from the source node after it >> has changed its selector to the working link and stopped sending traffic >> on the protection link (so the destination can stop transmitting on >> protection). >> >> Since RFC 4426 covers these Bridge and Switch messages briefly, more >> details should be specified on the operation and behavior in this >> reversion process. > > If you have specific questions, we would be happy to answer them. If you > believe that additional documentation is required, we would welcome your > contributions as an Internet-Draft. > >> Further, it would be helpful to understand why the actions are >> performed by source and destination nodes rather than master and >> slave nodes. It may be appropriate to reuse the master/slave roles >> in the reversion process just as is done in the switchover process. > > There is a distinction between the node that invokes a switchover > process (the master) and a node that performs the process. For > example, a Bridge and Switch Request message is sent by the source > node after it has bridged traffic back to both working and protection > links simply because the source node has performed the bridging and > is the only node that can know this fact. > >> In addition, RFC 4426 does not include an abstract message similar to >> the Failure Indication Message to request the beginning of the reversion >> procedure. It may be beneficial to include a message from the slave >> device to initiate reversion, just as there is a Failure Indication >> Message >> to initiate switchover. (RFC 4426 states that the Failure Indication >> Message may not be needed when the transport plane technology >> itself provides such a notification. The same may apply when a failure >> is cleared; however, there should still be an optional message to >> trigger the reversion process.) > > Reversion is described as an administrative procedure quite > deliberately. In our view it should not be a rapid response to a > specific situation triggered through the control plane by the 'master', > but should be a considered operation under the control of administrative > policy. The trigger is, therefore, outside the scope of the control plane. > This is in section 4.13 of RFC4427. > > We hope this answers your questions, and we would be happy to enter into > further dialog on these topics. > > Best regards, > Adrian Farrel and Deborah Brungard > CCAMP co-chairs > > > > > >
- Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection Adrian Farrel
- Re: Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection Wataru Imajuku
- Re: Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection Adrian Farrel
- RE: Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection MEURIC Julien RD-CORE-LAN
- Re: Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection Adrian Farrel
- Update: Draft response to OIF on 1:n protection Adrian Farrel