[CFRG] Re: Taking X-Wing to Independent Stream

[Dan Harkins <[e-mail]>]

   Are these implementers who don't want to deploy non-standard
cryptography aware of what a Independent Stream RFC is? It will
say:

    This is a contribution to the RFC Series, independently of any other
    RFC stream.  The RFC Editor has chosen to publish this document at
    its discretion and makes no statement about its value for
    implementation or deployment.  Documents approved for publication by
    the RFC Editor are not candidates for any level of Internet Standard;
    see Section 2 of RFC 7841.

Do they just need an RFC number?

   regards,

   Dan.

On 3/3/25 1:43 PM, Sophie Schmieg wrote:
> In my opinion, there is indeed some urgency to the adoption of X-Wing. 
> As mentioned, NIST is referring to it already, and several 
> implementors are itching to deploy it, but do not want to deploy 
> non-standard cryptography. This has led to the rather unfortunate 
> situation that pure deployment of PQC is currently far easier than 
> hybrid deployment, despite the hybrid deployment being recommended by 
> some regulators (mostly BSI and ANSSI).
>
> X-Wing has been well analyzed in academia [1], I don't think there are 
> any concerns about the cryptographic correctness that would warrant 
> further reviews here.
> The only counterargument I know of is that there are similar, but not 
> quite equivalent proposals that are more generic, but X-Wing, with its 
> already well-defined format, is in my opinion a much more mature 
> candidate, that given the time pressure to finally have a hybrid 
> standard out would be highly welcomed.
>
> [1] https://eprint.iacr.org/2024/039
>
> On Fri, Feb 28, 2025 at 11:20 PM Loganaden Velvindron 
> <[e-mail]> wrote:
>
>     Last time I checked, NIST is already referring to X-Wing.
>
>     "This is sometimes referred to as hybrid 978 PQ/T (post-quantum /
>     traditional) key establishment. For example, X-Wing is a hybrid 979
>     PQ/T KEM built from two components: ML-KEM (a lattice-based
>     post-quantum KEM) and 980 X25519 (a traditional Diffie-Hellman-style
>     key exchange)"
>
>     >From :
>     https://nvlpubs.nist.gov/nistpubs/SpecialPublications/NIST.SP.800-227.ipd.pdf
>
>     On Fri, 28 Feb 2025 at 22:27, John Mattsson
>     <john.mattsson=[e-mail]> wrote:
>     >
>     > Hi Deidre and the X-Wing Team,
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > I am happy to help with any effort to get X-Wing published as an
>     RFC. X-Wing is already the de facto standard for practical use of
>     ML-KEM in TLS, DTLS, and QUIC. I hope it will be MTI as soon as
>     possible. I think it is essential to document X-Wing in an RFC. I
>     think NIST should refer to X-Wing as a good example of a hybrid
>     KEM in SP 800-227. Chosing a fast secure Montgomery curve and
>     using SHA-3 as KDF are the optimal choices. I am against CFRG
>     combining ML-KEM with anything else.
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > The only problem with X-Wing is that it is not generic, but
>     X-Wing should be everybody's first hand choice if they want do
>     deploy ML-KEM.
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > Cheers,
>     >
>     > John
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > From: Rohan Mahy <[e-mail]>
>     > Date: Friday, 28 February 2025 at 18:23
>     > To: Deirdre Connolly <[e-mail]>
>     > Cc: CFRG <[e-mail]>, Independent Submissions Editor (Eliot
>     Lear) <[e-mail]>
>     > Subject: [CFRG] Re: Taking X-Wing to Independent Stream
>     >
>     > I'm willing to do document review.
>     >
>     > Thanks,
>     >
>     > -rohan
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > On Fri, Feb 28, 2025, 08:33 Deirdre Connolly
>     <[e-mail]> wrote:
>     >
>     > FYI the chairs have declined again to have an adoption call for
>     X-Wing. The authors are now in discussion with the Independent
>     Stream Editor to pursue review and publication there.
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-connolly-cfrg-xwing-kem/
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > If you wish to volunteer document and cryptographic reviews for
>     X-Wing we can take those to the ISE.
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > Thanks for all the interest and support!
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > Cheers,
>     >
>     > Deirdre, on behalf of the X-Wing Team
>     >
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>
>
> -- 
>
> Sophie Schmieg | Information Security Engineer | ISE 
> Crypto |[e-mail]
>
>
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