[Dcpel] FWD: [Re: proposed charter]
David Kessens <david.kessens@nokia.com> Thu, 09 March 2006 05:49 UTC
Received: from [127.0.0.1] (helo=stiedprmman1.va.neustar.com) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1FHE1b-0006wu-2m; Thu, 09 Mar 2006 00:49:23 -0500
Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1FHE1Z-0006wp-I8 for dcpel@ietf.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2006 00:49:21 -0500
Received: from mgw-ext01.nokia.com ([131.228.20.93]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1FHE1Z-00046g-3a for dcpel@ietf.org; Thu, 09 Mar 2006 00:49:21 -0500
Received: from esebh107.NOE.Nokia.com (esebh107.ntc.nokia.com [172.21.143.143]) by mgw-ext01.nokia.com (Switch-3.1.7/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id k295nJb3023987 for <dcpel@ietf.org>; Thu, 9 Mar 2006 07:49:20 +0200
Received: from esebh001.NOE.Nokia.com ([172.21.138.28]) by esebh107.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 9 Mar 2006 07:49:16 +0200
Received: from dadhcp-172019068136.americas.nokia.com ([172.18.141.58]) by esebh001.NOE.Nokia.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6881); Thu, 9 Mar 2006 07:49:16 +0200
Received: from dadhcp-172019068136.americas.nokia.com (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by dadhcp-172019068136.americas.nokia.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) with ESMTP id k295nEfe029580 for <dcpel@ietf.org>; Wed, 8 Mar 2006 21:49:14 -0800
Received: (from kessens@localhost) by dadhcp-172019068136.americas.nokia.com (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id k295nEcN029578 for dcpel@ietf.org; Wed, 8 Mar 2006 21:49:14 -0800
Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2006 21:49:14 -0800
From: David Kessens <david.kessens@nokia.com>
To: dcpel@ietf.org
Message-ID: <20060309054914.GA29529@nokia.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Disposition: inline
User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.1i
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Mar 2006 05:49:16.0777 (UTC) FILETIME=[33CCE590:01C6433D]
X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/)
X-Scan-Signature: 41c17b4b16d1eedaa8395c26e9a251c4
Subject: [Dcpel] FWD: [Re: proposed charter]
X-BeenThere: dcpel@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5
Precedence: list
List-Id: Mailing list for possible diffserv control plane elements WG <dcpel.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcpel>, <mailto:dcpel-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www1.ietf.org/pipermail/dcpel>
List-Post: <mailto:dcpel@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dcpel-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcpel>, <mailto:dcpel-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: dcpel-bounces@ietf.org
Kathie asked me whether I would be willing to share the following mail with the group on my current thinking regarding a bof for dcepl. I obviously have no problem with that so please see below for my mail to Kathie regarding this topic. I, and the other ADs CC'ed on this mail, are interested in your comments. I hope this helps, David Kessens --- ----- Forwarded message from David Kessens <david.kessens@nokia.com> ----- Date: Mon, 6 Mar 2006 20:58:32 -0800 From: David Kessens <david.kessens@nokia.com> To: Kathleen Nichols <nichols@pollere.com> Subject: Re: proposed charter Kathie, On Wed, Feb 22, 2006 at 10:51:34AM -0800, Kathleen Nichols wrote: > > Attached is a draft charter. Scott and Paulo haven't had a > chance to weigh in on it, so I might get some good input > there. I would hope to have better milestones after an > organizational meeting or BoF. I am sorry for the delay in my response. We normally spend some time to do an internal review with the IAB and IESG and I was waiting for Allison who promised comments. I am sympathic to the goals of this proposed work and I have received various comments from the IAB stating so. However, I also received comments that this work could be conflicting with existing IETF work in the NSIS and TSV working group. While the proposed charter doesn't necessarily would require protocol work, the drafts that I read would more or less require this. As you know, the Ops part of the Ops&Mgmt area usually doesn't do protocol work and limits itself to issues that are relevant to the operations of the Internet. In addition, to make sure that things are relevant for operators, we normally want to have feedback, support and involvement from operators to avoid situations where vendors build all kind of complex solutions for problems that operators don't have. So far, I have seen some support from academia, research efforts within larger corporations and some vendors, but I have seen little evidence that this group is going to solve a problem that operators want to be solved. As I already mentioned in an earlier mail, I am really somewhat surprised that I haven't seen any operator on the list commenting that we need to start this work as I did expect that myself. Considering these issues, I think that it probably is not in your best interest to pursue a bof for this IETF. We will first need a much clearer answer on what problem is going to be solved *for operators*, get real support from operators behind this effort and after that we need to figure out whether that solution will involve protocol work or not. You can probably convince me to hold a bof anyways but considering the above stumbling blocks, I would advise you not to do so. David Kessens --- _______________________________________________ Dcpel mailing list Dcpel@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcpel
- [Dcpel] FWD: [Re: proposed charter] David Kessens
- [Dcpel] FWD: [Re: proposed charter] David Kessens
- Re: [Dcpel] FWD: [Re: proposed charter] Olivier Dugeon