Re: [dmarc-ietf] RESENT fields?

Ken O'Driscoll <ken@wemonitoremail.com> Wed, 07 October 2020 11:35 UTC

Return-Path: <ken@wemonitoremail.com>
X-Original-To: dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 416EA3A0A2B for <dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 7 Oct 2020 04:35:37 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.1
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=wemonitoremail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bOyWJ4MtXvft for <dmarc@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 7 Oct 2020 04:35:35 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from EUR05-AM6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-am6eur05on2115.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.22.115]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 26D083A0A21 for <dmarc@ietf.org>; Wed, 7 Oct 2020 04:35:34 -0700 (PDT)
ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=JueZDKOFq9oWsMa6u7QNP5ADQ/EzHaJHBi7EvfMJZlYmINKheKBzaDPWJWROCeR8KKbJDMJCtrp/kAvFPUv1uYlfc18E+Q8hkr8mgR5CL/TB+fKlqish5na4H6aGvCBEjQpDaD2XRRXqf5iSog8QVdrFsjJBEvzHfs15ddHj1J4cpwRpLHSNBYnIpjo3mUqsKUio8zTiZQzm9Ut9XLSAFas+a/nlQnFyR6A5MFkZBXZHUdvftsvL4mdQSgbT8p01BT+m1VNwt3nZ3xrBaZ0bo7ls4bXmbvBSPlrcqodZpwHgCIu6LH0HG7BGbezdC275wMGyZpuUtzIC71n7oxwx3A==
ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=aKTaJaLBeWJQRqEn1Yt7MRshIPi95HT46t1MzL3Fs+c=; b=SsodoYhAsGT0j5y8mdqOqOA1eryC0snqfrq4djraNBsQG+SWCFTuPhm6fTGXD/ch1UyPCFqf3+4vtXl9DFSufVFI0jmAP8HbnuGbzW5vyjQ5wj8FEfsWhTVl2XJORC583YTw1rY2UvHKpjzFKVtrxakwTfByyvmg6FTDhAeNIDQl8jeX7q+Ne+wzV7/saF/+OkWxJvTOdHwhPnE6FmqbspQxKhJlYfMiPpTdtasoYVXXDxmBHWFt17J1bMrkn72nHO3WKokT/4P0X+I7wwJUM0hf44B6I80oYQGrHbJqKT1eAlhcvMI29UwhrHzx4XfnGqBEn5l2ZE/osKrsCyN6Wg==
ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=wemonitoremail.com; dmarc=pass action=none header.from=wemonitoremail.com; dkim=pass header.d=wemonitoremail.com; arc=none
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=wemonitoremail.com; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=aKTaJaLBeWJQRqEn1Yt7MRshIPi95HT46t1MzL3Fs+c=; b=LKCMCUBss9iDT7QXllXoaSBZTkEzrnxdiXUKAH0JYLd3cqVLEY9scCAkTzOOUhyIGf6AxBBF3uBMDAws21YAbqr133VWvQOSsvX9ryDxNjlw5/I6H6sHtvAK/bIp4ytx18SSmV8Qw/fBdGpE2VA9YCKhAukCtexJcuewYVVwTplt14WTfojfRJ3Xv8QDLxXSKWZkZfKQyeKO5CrXUrtSxySuHlvQpsTW7sB+CwPKuWzntRgdke59bsi3FYXUK5l7rAEXls1Ak3lLeVwqwmRDzjCQI1hzo4OWySbr7iBIbtR19A7SUVKpQxqPhFT3jH0kpfh2pmfRJeyjL8aNz2jL2Q==
Received: from VI1PR01MB7053.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com (2603:10a6:800:19a::9) by VE1PR01MB6112.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com (2603:10a6:803:127::33) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.3455.22; Wed, 7 Oct 2020 11:35:31 +0000
Received: from VI1PR01MB7053.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com ([fe80::8bc:5ccf:ec3f:385d]) by VI1PR01MB7053.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com ([fe80::8bc:5ccf:ec3f:385d%7]) with mapi id 15.20.3455.023; Wed, 7 Oct 2020 11:35:30 +0000
From: Ken O'Driscoll <ken@wemonitoremail.com>
To: "dmarc@ietf.org" <dmarc@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [dmarc-ietf] RESENT fields?
Thread-Index: AQHWnFQkeJJm/Sd6vE2wcTRKHIcUbamL44IQ
Date: Wed, 07 Oct 2020 11:35:30 +0000
Message-ID: <VI1PR01MB70535B6952A4216D394C6C46C70A0@VI1PR01MB7053.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com>
References: <e979ca77650640c0a304b655855b2367@bayviewphysicians.com>
In-Reply-To: <e979ca77650640c0a304b655855b2367@bayviewphysicians.com>
Accept-Language: en-GB, en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
authentication-results: ietf.org; dkim=none (message not signed) header.d=none;ietf.org; dmarc=none action=none header.from=wemonitoremail.com;
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 461a4ae1-fe76-4a68-10e3-08d86ab518b5
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: VE1PR01MB6112:
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <VE1PR01MB611254ABB1407A91F9B5B426C70A0@VE1PR01MB6112.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com>
x-ms-oob-tlc-oobclassifiers: OLM:8882;
x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1
x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: qmGAYaEd4xFRMh0zp/NjkVRQqUwjfmY6DY9Q66Wi6xxncYbPWkJIgEs5fnbQCagt30VFNnYSsI7fS3w79nzePA7OYHa7AxqjxpSbw50itnxK3rv+4sxg4P+DQR4D53wngv5buWE6upvtNUTGTcCAhvUMg3y+q46elLajErZOOUtrHpdOToBYxrhy/GMaQcapLV/Qx4812RbPYsRMny0suDbdnk42TUHBvE+t8GV2FheUNGwJuGd7KqirbOBjnsUQ9+s076CmqssavD2t6IY+VlnKJtuvqrTFyv/zuTbex14ZAHIRwLeT20uW/2vGSAfFgqklrpQ1cKCHjeMeti1/og==
x-forefront-antispam-report: CIP:255.255.255.255; CTRY:; LANG:en; SCL:1; SRV:; IPV:NLI; SFV:NSPM; H:VI1PR01MB7053.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com; PTR:; CAT:NONE; SFS:(396003)(136003)(366004)(39830400003)(34096005)(376002)(346002)(76116006)(66946007)(55016002)(66556008)(64756008)(66446008)(66476007)(5660300002)(33656002)(8936002)(52536014)(6506007)(53546011)(7696005)(186003)(26005)(9686003)(83380400001)(478600001)(316002)(71200400001)(2906002)(8676002)(6916009)(86362001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102;
x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata: 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
x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_VI1PR01MB70535B6952A4216D394C6C46C70A0VI1PR01MB7053eurp_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: wemonitoremail.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: VI1PR01MB7053.eurprd01.prod.exchangelabs.com
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 461a4ae1-fe76-4a68-10e3-08d86ab518b5
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 07 Oct 2020 11:35:30.6859 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: a2b1d6fe-fc8b-4b7c-b9f1-d7b1ab3d23b3
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: 8cpAYOfKXTddwKX0WYdXmRLrD6Jny1tVlE0eyG49FYXSHdbOP6g07fKvvbn9IGnjzv0o7T2OfEcb84MUAuK95Q==
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: VE1PR01MB6112
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dmarc/0ihZWoTRBcdZpL9e52PQqfbviT4>
Subject: Re: [dmarc-ietf] RESENT fields?
X-BeenThere: dmarc@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Domain-based Message Authentication, Reporting, and Compliance \(DMARC\)" <dmarc.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dmarc>, <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dmarc/>
List-Post: <mailto:dmarc@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dmarc>, <mailto:dmarc-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Oct 2020 11:35:37 -0000

The "resent" fields are currently used for their stated purpose, which as you correctly note, is to signal that a message has been re-introduced into the mail transport. These fields are typically used when a message which has already been delivered to a mailbox is resent unmodified (and possibly after a delay) to another email address.

A mailing list does not resend messages, it modifies and re-posts them to a subscriber list. The 5322.From and/or 5322.Sender fields are therefore more appropriate for mailing lists because they indicate the originator of the now re-posted/modified original message.

Ken.

From: dmarc <dmarc-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Douglas E. Foster
Sent: Wednesday 7 October 2020 03:47
To: dmarc@ietf.org
Subject: [dmarc-ietf] RESENT fields?

Are the RESENT fields from RFC 5322 an interesting idea that everybody has ignored?    For purposes of this discussion, they interest me because they provide a way of documenting changes to the SMTP sender, the From Header, and the recipient list.  RFC 5322 Section 3.6.6 says they SHOULD by added whenever a message is re-introduced to the transport system.   Mailing list activity seems to fit the language and intent of this section.   But I do not see any RESENT fields on the most recent posts to this list.   In fact, I am not sure that I have ever seen a message anywhere with these fields.

Application:
For forwarded messages, I don't want to trust the forwarder's spam filter, so I want to reconstruct the message identity as it appeared when the message entered the forwarder's ADMD.   The Resent fields would allow that logic to be developed, but I would also need forwarders to use those fields.   The usage would also need to apply to auto-forwarders, even though they are explicitly exempted from the RESENT header recommendation in the current RFC.

Doug Foster