Re: [Dots] Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis-05

mohamed.boucadair@orange.com Mon, 22 March 2021 11:58 UTC

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From: <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>
To: Michael Tuexen <tuexen@fh-muenster.de>
CC: "tsv-art@ietf.org" <tsv-art@ietf.org>, "dots@ietf.org" <dots@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis.all@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis.all@ietf.org>, "last-call@ietf.org" <last-call@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis-05
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Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2021 11:58:18 +0000
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References: <161636957782.14687.3973826310014534947@ietfa.amsl.com> <19201_1616395378_60583C72_19201_281_1_787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B9330353590AB@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <DF63CB57-1AC4-4FB6-9F62-7B6DB3541496@fh-muenster.de> <9482_1616405491_605863F3_9482_55_1_787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B93303535925D@OPEXCAUBMA2.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <AC50FA72-FDFB-495D-92BC-AC29581E1644@fh-muenster.de>
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Subject: Re: [Dots] Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis-05
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Re-

Thanks, Michael. 

The proposed change is now implemented in our local copy. It can be tracked at https://tinyurl.com/8782bis-latest.

Cheers,
Med

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Michael Tuexen [mailto:tuexen@fh-muenster.de]
> Envoyé : lundi 22 mars 2021 10:53
> À : BOUCADAIR Mohamed TGI/OLN
> <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>
> Cc : tsv-art@ietf.org; dots@ietf.org; draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-
> bis.all@ietf.org; last-call@ietf.org
> Objet : Re: Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis-05
> 
> > On 22. Mar 2021, at 10:31, <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>
> <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com> wrote:
> >
> > Re-,
> >
> > Please see inline.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Med
> >
> >> -----Message d'origine-----
> >> De : tuexen@fh-muenster.de [mailto:tuexen@fh-muenster.de]
> >> Envoyé : lundi 22 mars 2021 10:04
> >> À : BOUCADAIR Mohamed TGI/OLN
> >> <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>
> >> Cc : tsv-art@ietf.org; dots@ietf.org; draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-
> >> bis.all@ietf.org; last-call@ietf.org
> >> Objet : Re: Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis-05
> >>
> >>> On 22. Mar 2021, at 07:42, <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>
> >> <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hi Michael,
> >>>
> >>> Thank you for the review.
> >>>
> >>> The motivation was used as it was the key element in the
> discussion
> >> in Section 3.3.3 of RFC1122, but you made a fair comment.
> >>>
> >>> ==
> >>>        DISCUSSION:
> >>>             Picking the correct datagram size to use when sending data
> >>>             is a complex topic [IP:9].
> >>>
> >>>             (a)  In general, no host is required to accept an IP
> >>>                  datagram larger than 576 bytes (including header and
> >>>                  data), so a host must not send a larger datagram
> >>>                  without explicit knowledge or prior arrangement with
> >>>                  the destination host.
> >>> ==
> >>>
> >>> We can update the text as follows:
> >>>
> >>> OLD:
> >>>  assume a PMTU of 576 bytes for IPv4 datagrams, as every IPv4
> host
> >>>  must be capable of receiving a packet whose length is equal to
> 576
> >>>  bytes as discussed in [RFC0791] and [RFC1122].
> >>>
> >>> NEW:
> >>>  assume a PMTU of 576 bytes for IPv4 datagrams (see Section 3.3.3
> >> of [RFC1122]).
> >> Hi Med,
> >>
> >> let me try to get my point clear:
> >>
> >> You can use Section 3.3.3 of [RFC1122] to motivate that the sender
> >> should
> >> not send datagram larger than 576, since there is no guarantee that
> the
> >> receiver has resources to reassemble and process it. But RFC 1122
> >> makes
> >> no statement about the path.
> >
> > [Med] There is this text in RFC1122:
> >
> >              Since nearly all networks in the Internet currently
> >              support an MTU of 576 or greater, we strongly recommend
> >              the use of 576 for datagrams sent to non-local networks.
> OK. Then I' fine with your proposed text.
> Please note that this is a statement from 1989. It is fine if you can live
> with that number, I would
> guess that such a number is larger today (at least in the context of
> WebRTC a number in the order of
> 1200 bytes was used).
> 
> Best regards
> Michael
> >
> > As far as I know there is no safe value
> >> for
> >> a PMTU you can derive from a specification.
> >>
> >
> > [Med] I agree with you. Things are more clear for IPv6.
> >
> >>
> >> So maybe:
> >> NEW:
> >>  assume a PMTU of 576 bytes for IPv4 datagrams (see Section 3.3.3
> of
> >> [RFC1122]
> >>  for support at the receiver).
> >>
> >> Best regards
> >> Michael
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>> Med
> >>>
> >>>> -----Message d'origine-----
> >>>> De : Michael Tüxen via Datatracker [mailto:noreply@ietf.org]
> >>>> Envoyé : lundi 22 mars 2021 00:33
> >>>> À : tsv-art@ietf.org
> >>>> Cc : dots@ietf.org; draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis.all@ietf.org; last-
> >>>> call@ietf.org
> >>>> Objet : Tsvart last call review of draft-ietf-dots-rfc8782-bis-05
> >>>>
> >>>> Reviewer: Michael Tüxen
> >>>> Review result: Ready with Nits
> >>>>
> >>>> This document has been reviewed as part of the transport area
> >> review
> >>>> team's ongoing effort to review key IETF documents. These
> >> comments
> >>>> were written primarily for the transport area directors, but are
> >> copied
> >>>> to the document's authors and WG to allow them to address any
> >>>> issues raised and also to the IETF discussion list for information.
> >>>>
> >>>> When done at the time of IETF Last Call, the authors should
> >> consider
> >>>> this review as part of the last-call comments they receive. Please
> >>>> always CC tsv-art@ietf.org if you reply to or forward this review.
> >>>>
> >>>>> From a transport perspective, there is one minor issue:
> >>>> Section 7.3 provides a motivation for using a path MTU for IPv4 of
> >> 576
> >>>> bytes.
> >>>> The motivation refers to the requirement that a receiver is
> capable
> >> of
> >>>> receiving IPv4 packets of that size, however they can be received
> >>>> fragmented.
> >>>> While it is acceptable to use 576 bytes as the minimum PMTU,
> the
> >>>> motivation does not hold.

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